HMMM. forum for just SASBE seeds. I'm thinking about it BUT, Not sure I'm fully on board with the idea. Playing devil's advocate here and "some experience" in trading, been doing it since july 2003. If we split the forums up into seed exchange only and SASBE/BEAP only, is see some problems or at least some potential problems. Problems may not be the best word, but possibly more confusion than we already have; and, trying to be polite here, we have enough confusion already and don't need any more added to it. What I see is this. Most, if not all of us post a trade list and either mark our seeds with SASBE after the seed or separate lists my posting something like These seeds for trade only. My trade list is clearly marked that way, but it never fails that when I post SASBE/BEAP offers or Trades or SASBE/BEAP and clearly state that I am really only looking for trades on my want list. Glad to look at your trade page though as there may be something on it that I forgot to put on my want list, I get members wanting my trade seeds only as well as SASBE seeds. So if we where to split the forums, how would we list the seeds? Don't know about others, but often I look at SASBE/BEAP offers to see if there is anything there that I want from my want list or the member has seeds on a trade list that I would want and I have something they want as well. If we have 2 different forums, that would mean looking at 2 different forums to check on seeds. That could make for even more confusion for both newbies and oldies as well. I also think that people will ignore the SASBE/BEAP forum more often than not. Just may be the nature of people. Back in the old days, when the infamous Spike owned GW, (no Sue don't pick on me about Spike, I agree people got very very dizzy on their travels to Disney, me included), there was one thing he did fairly well. He kept the rules of the forums links working well, deleted the begging posts, and sent GW e-mails to those that did about breaking the rules. Now we have too many links that don't work and I wonder how many people, newbies, ignore the post we have going about the instructions about seed trading because they are posted by a member and not GW itself. GW isn't monitoring the seed exchange very well, and most of those begging posts, want seeds for postage posts are not deleted. We, as members, can post to them about the rules, but I don't know how many actually listen to what is posted. We also have far too many members both new and old that respond to them with offers of seeds. As long as members just respond to the "beggars" it will continue. I've seen threads started with want seeds for postage, nothing to trade and members respond with seeds, then a member posts about the rules and that post is ignored. I honestly think it would be far better to somehow get GW to respond to the beggar posts and delete them, than to add a forum just for SASBE/BEAP seeds. It just seems to me that too many people are coming on as newbies and are not interested in reading any rules of the forum, no matter where they are posted, and I don't understand that. Could it be that I'm "old"? Not in my 20's, 30's, 40's, but rather in my late 50's and I think of rules and finding out how the forum works before getting involvoed? I remember when I first joined GW and was reading on the different garden forums. Before doing anything or posting, I read the rules of GW, the rules of each of the forums and carefully followed them and how things worked on the different forums. If he case is that people just don't bother to read, or don't care to read, or just ignore the rules on the seed exchange because they are posted by a member, then I don't think it will matter if we have separate forums for trades and SASBE/BEAP seeds and plants. I'm afraid that when you add the forum like this it will just create further confusion and Lord knows, we have enough of that. Fran

Rjinga, I have a very mature rosemary bush that had grown in a similar pattern to yours. I was very hesitant some years ago about doing hard pruning. I finally got the nerve cut it back hard. The plant is still with us and healthy (and has been hard pruned several more times). I have several more rosemary bushes that are babies of the original plant. When our original plant "sprawled", I looked underneath it and noticed some of the longer, lower lying branches that touched the ground had rooted themselves with no help from me at all. I carefully cut them away from the mother plant, dug them up and kept them in pots for a while to let them develop better root systems, and then transplanted them. That's how I have obtained most of my rosemary bushes although I started a couple from cuttings. Just wanted to see if I could do it. My guess about the existing root system is that you will find the main root system is one plant and I don't think you can divide it. Maybe others have more knowledge on that. I have never tried it because I know for certain our original plant was a single bush. I grew it from seed. If you look under the sprawling branches that touch the ground, give them a little tug where they touch and you will be able to tell if they have put down roots. If yes, you have free plants :~). Hope this helps.

The distinction isn't that meaningful in my view. What I think matters more to a gardener is climate of origin. For example, native sages of California and the Cape area of South Africa have more in common than sages of California and tropical Mexico because both California and the Cape are winter-rainfall, summer-drought climates, and the salvias there reflect that growth pattern (both are also fire ecologies, so germinating seeds of some species from those regions require smoke treatment, naturally or with Liquid Smoke). Tropical salvias from Mexico are summer-rainfall and tolerate little frost. Some Chinese salvias come from summer-rainfall subtropical regions, and some salvias are montaine and don't like high temperatures and humidities. These climate characteristics are probably the best clue to whether a particular salvia will succeed for you. David

Rained overnight, but so far, just gray and damp today. Up early, e-mailing my RE agent with a few questions. Cleaned out the remaining kitchen cabinets, bathroom closet. Met the inspectors who came out to check the heater/ac we had installed last year. Called town hall to alert them we'd be moving (for water/sewer bills); called township garage to arrange a final water meter reading. Called Inheritance tax office to change my address on the estate I'm executrix for; wrote the necessary letter for the Inher. tax address change. Spent the last hour plowing through DH's retirement package--he has a phone interview re: our choices scheduled for tomorrow. Somewhere in there I ate a biscuit, and a few slices of cheese and called it lunch.