My post is speculation - I don't know that a virus is the causal agent, though evidence makes it seem a likely suspect. My observation suggests a problem with the rootstock but doesn't rule out involvement of the rest of the tree. So it may be that a commensal virus of the rootstock becomes distributed throughout the tree in a latent form. If scions are taken from this tree and grafted elsewhere, it is possible that the viruses will later become active and the signs of the disease will be expressed. So the problem with your multi-grafted tree is that there may be a higher chance of infection since any of the scions could have brought latent virus to the tree,

I know I'm on a hobbyhorse, but I spent decades studying shoot growth, mainly in pines, and have some strong convictions on how best to approach and describe it. First, you need a model of normal development. Then when something unusual happens, you can intuit what is causing it. Example -- in northern pines of the simplest structure (ponderosa, strobus, Austrian, Scots, etc.) the apical meristem inside the leading bud tip forms a winter bud in the late summer. This goes dormant. Next spring, it comes out of dormancy after receiving enough cold for its chilling needs, and then enough heat to stimulate cell division. Gotta have both. Then the bud elongates into a shoot, exposing the fascicles that overwintered in the bud as miniatures. During elongation, a new bud is forming to repeat this cycle. Length of the new shoot is determined by the number of fascicles formed in the bud the previous year. These fascicles have a very strong tendency to space out on the new shoot evenly at a distance apart that varies by species.Drought in the spring prevents the full distance from being achieved (and needles reaching their full length). That's why transplants with injured roots have "brush" shoots with short needles jammed together. That damaged tree will probably put few new fascicles into its next bud, so next year's shoot will have normal fascicle spacing but fewer of them, and will also be shorter than it should. But the next bud should have normal number of fascicles, and full spacing between them, and therefore a nice long shoot should develop from it. This "mind-model" does have nuances and ins-and-outs; but it's a good starting point for understanding simple pines. More complex pines like contorta, southern pines, jack and Monterey take more work to figure out. Spruces and firs are much like simple pines in structure. Trees without buds (Cypress family) are another story. As for nutrients -- the elongating shoot produces hormones that cause the older needles to export carbs to the growth areas. By mid-summer the new shoots are living off their own photosynthesis; and then they start to store the excess so next year they can help out the newer shoots now appearing. This goes easier with a blackboard! Don't mean to diss anyone, I just feel strongly that bad vocabulary creates muddy thinking.

"like that would be a big problem for you.. lol ... that would just be a new opportunity " Ken not the case at all.... A lot of my cultivars revolve around this tree for filtered shade. This tree is a big player in the over all design and well being of many plants. I will pass along the only benefit that these gum balls afford. Put them under your Hostas. The slugs and snails cannot tolerate the sharp spiny needles. Since that discovery I always have the best looking Hostas. Dave

Hi Ken, "how can i diagnose the sudden death syndrome ... in other words... if you were to walk up to it"... I lost my Cham t.'Red Star' the same way. No visible sign of any issues with either foliage or roots. 5 years was all it lasted. They just croak for no reason. Especially thyroids. A hard one to grow at least for me. You know what you tell everybody: "You got to enjoy it for 5 years now it's time to move on". Just think you get to buy something else new and exciting to replace it. Dave