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Cooler weather encourages less intense color

Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A

14 years ago

Our nights are now getting into the upper 50s on average. Daytime highs are in upper 60s to mid-70s (ÂºF) and days are getting shorter, sun less intense. I've noticed the blooms are quite a bit less saturated in color. Does this ever happen in California? Texas? Florida? You guys are SO much further South though, but maybe in Oct./Nov.?

Here is Cooktown Sunset now:

Here was Cooktown several weeks ago:

Here is Plastic Pink now (just started). But I really like this look.

Here was Plastic Pink last year (bloomed at height of summer):

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Comments (6)

island_plumeria
14 years ago
I am from Southern California. Yes, I have found that heat affects both size and color. Although not all varieties. Whites and yellows do not seem to be affected, however pinks and reds change the most.

I can have the same variety bloom on the coast and inland, about a 15 deg temperature difference, and the cool temp flowers will bloom larger with softer colors and the hotter ones (100 plus) will bloom smaller with deeper colors.

If I knew how to post a photo I would.
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meyermike_1micha
14 years ago
Dave...WHAT THE HECK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!!

You have the most beautiful, most desireable looking plumies on this site, next to a few others that have the advantage of growing them in warmer areas than you.

If you are saying they are duller ok. But I tell you, duller or not, they are still so so beautuful Dave...STRONG WORK my friend!
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Temps in the 70s and 80s are what I would call average. High temps would be 90s and 100s and lows 60s and below.. For me high temps are 90s and up that we get in July and August. The roses tend to be paler in color but not all of them. There are a few that actually get brighter in hot weather. Cooler temps are 60 and below. And not necessarily daytime temps but the night temps which begin to dip down into the 50s and 60s in late August and September. The colors can get deeper and/or brighter then. However, when it starts getting much colder, like 30s and 40s, they get pale again. Of course that could also be due to the reduced sunlight as it gets later in the season.
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I feel like the amount of water, the soil fertility and the warm temperatures all play a role in the amount of hot, pungent flavor that hot peppers develop. However, I grow mostly jalapenos and not many true Anaheim-type chiles so what I am writing from first-hand experience is related more to jalapeno peppers. I find it is true of habaneros as well. In my garden, for the hottest flavor, I plant peppers into well-prepared, rich and fertile soil, but I never fertilize them after that unless they show symptoms of nutritional deficiency, which they almost never do. I think overfeeding with fertilizer somehow hurts their flavor and makes it less hot. I water the peppers adequately in spring before they are setting peppers. After they bloom and set peppers I gradually cut back on their moisture and grow them as dry as possible. Too much water seems to have an adverse flavor on their heat. I let the plants get almost (but not quite) to the wilt point before I water, and then I don't water heavily. I do not deliberately let them wilt, but both last summer and this summer at very high temperatures (roughly 108-112) they would wilt before I realized it. And, yes, my hot peppers have been super-hot this year as they were last year. The jalapenos I harvest in July and August are definitely hotter in flavor than those harvested in June. Then, as we go deeper into fall, the peppers are a little milder as the temperatures cool down. With most hot peppers the majority of the heat is in the white membrane and the seeds get some of the flavor from the membrane. I use that knowledge when cooking or canning with peppers to control, to some extent, the degree of pungency in whatever I am canning or cooking. This summer, my jalapenos and habs have been so hot that I have to wear 2 pairs of medical-type latex or nitrile gloves when handling the hot peppers. With the habs, if I am working with them for any amount of time, I have to change the gloves every few minutes because the capsaicin seems to find its way through the two layers of gloves and onto my skin. I am a big pepper wimp and don't like the burning sensation on my skin, so if I am cutting up more than one single jalapeno, I always wear gloves. Carol, My dad always made pepper sauce that way. It is funnier that the older I get, the more I find myself doing things the same way he did them. The issue of peppers not being as hot as expected was discussed on the Hot Pepper Forum a couple of weeks ago, and much of what the pepper experts there said was similar to what Jay and I have observed with regard to the environmental influences on pepper flavor. I'm going to find that thread and link it below. Dawn Here is a link that might be useful: Pepper Thread from Hot Pepper Forum
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GM, One plant that immediately came to mind that would give a contrasting color would be barberry (comes in mounding forms and strongly vertical forms like 'Helmond Pillar')and comes in both reddish-purple and golden yellow versions. Their leaves are pretty small, so you might want something with a larger leaf size that would contrast more with the boxwood leaves. My second thought was that one of the reddish-purplish or golden-yellow dwarf nandinas might be a good choice. There are tons of dwarf hybrid nandina varieties that could work for you, and their leaves would be a nice contrast with the boxwood. There's also some great dwarf semi-evergreen abelias, like "Silver Anniversary" and "Golden Anniversary". For something with larger leaves, you could go with one of the Japanese Holly (Ilex crenata) cultivars, like 'Heller' which forms a mound 3' tall by 3' wide. Or, there's the Blue Holly (Ilex meservae) family which includes "Blue Princess" and "Blue Prince" (you need both of them to get pollination if you want berries). One of the absolute best sources for terrific shrubs in Oklahoma is Sooner Plant Form. I've linked their website so you can look at some of the shrubs they carry. Dawn Here is a link that might be useful: Evergreen Broadleaf Shrubs/Sooner Plant Farm
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Dave, I bought two cuttings from two different sources in 2008. Both ended up having identical flowers and growth habits. I bought one separately, end of season bargain with roots which had an odd name I haven't seen since ("Multiple Gold"). I bought three others a few months earlier, including one called "J4". I bought a J105 and an Irma 5 at the same time from the same grower as I bought the J4, and both bloomed true to form, as did the one tagged J4. So I am convinced that this larger one must be the same as the J4 I got from the first grower (both Thai growers via Ebay, btw).
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Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
Original Author
14 years ago
OK Mike. I got you. But here's the thing. If you pay MONEY for these, and you go by the photo on EBay or whatever, and have your heart set on it looking like that, just know that it's not necessarily going to if your climate is on the cool side.
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tropicalzone7
14 years ago
Im a bit north of you, and I am also noticing alot less intense colors (but the colors werent too intense to begin with because it started blooming when the weather was cooler). Temps here are in the mid to upper 50s at night now and in the low to mid 70s (some upper 70s some mid 60s) during the day. The flower size was much smaller too when we got hit by that coastal storm (which eventually knocked all the flowers off my plumie in the high winds), but we got a short lived warm up into the low 80s that made the flowers opening on those days much nicer. Also the inflo. on my pretty princess is not budging at all. It didnt drop off though so thats a good sign, but Im still not expecting any flowers (but I might bring it in early so it can stay warm enough to get some flowers on it).

Unfortunately summer has come to a end, and I definately think my plumerias are one of the first to be effected by this early fall weather. My coconut palm isnt too happy either, and my cannas are completely unfazed. good luck, at least you can look forward to even more blooms and taller plants next year.
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tdogdad
14 years ago
Dave- you are exactly correct. Heat and humidity brings out rich colors and shade, cooler weather, and dryness can bring larger flowers but more subdued colors. Some flowers actually change coloration like my Lani that is almost red in the heat, deep pink in warm and streaked with yellow in cooler weather. Jeannie Moragne can go from rich red, to orange to yellow. I have pictures of this if anyone wants to see. Bill
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meyermike_1micha
14 years ago
Dave....I was complimenting you at the same time while I was kidding with ya...
You are so right....Ihave had some plants grow entirely different than what expected, and what a disappointment. Make you wish one could live in an area where plants just thrive and do what you want them to do all year long.

have a great weekend my friend. It is going to be cool one tonight..:-)
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