From digdirt.... "Now if growing in a greenhouse, yes that info is available because gh growers can control the air temps inside the structure."........... Yea I was thinking about ways to have an ideal air temp when growing indoors and in a greenhouse from sprout to transplanting time to see if they grow healthier and better before transplant time....I currently have lists of a general idea of the height in the greenhouse to put the plants ....low to the ground for cold and higher up for hot. Thank you for the response digdirt and now thanks to you I am looking up soil temp control :). To Slimy_Okra...thanks for the temps! Thanks theforgottenone for this message... "Unless you're able to manipulate the temperature of the air and keep it consistent at all times there is really no reason to aim for an "ideal" anything. It's just not possible. Especially outside. Even day and night temperatures can fluctuate 20 or more degrees. So what's "ideal" during the day won't be "ideal" at night. You can influence air temps to an extent by growing under cover when it's chilly and by using shade cloth when it's warm (somewhat) but for the most part you're at the mercy of Mother Nature. As long as a crop is withing the range of low temp and high temp they will grow just fine."... I sort of have a response to this....My greenhouse has about 7 to 8 different heights and I am trying to order my plants by temperature. .I was thinking about your response and I think the reason why I am looking for an ideal temp is because I am thinking about having the veggies at the correct height in order to have an ideal temp when the sun is out in the day. I was thinking this would maximize growing. Also for the nighttime thing I have a clear water aquirium and a ton of clear used milk bottles and soda bottles on the upper part of the green house where it gets above 100F...then at night when the heat stored in the water dissipates I have a minifan that blows the dissipated air down a vent into bricks on the floor of the greenhouse which keeps the temperatures much higher at the night. I am going to try a ton of science experiments...just don't know what they are yet :) I guess right now if nothing else then I would like a confirmation that the order am putting the veggies in from to coldest to hottest loving plants is accurate (or close to accurate) Here is the order again(and also on my flag cold-to-hot measurement picture).... Coldest …. 1. Kale(pretty sure kale is one of the coldest if not the coldest)....I have this as a starting point in the center of the blue cross in the hot red Norwegian flag.......then it goes to the all blue, cold Greek flag starting with Spinach 2. Spinach(yellow and orange “Green Hornet” symbol...yellow and orange due to spinach goes well with high acidity tropical fruits in green smoothies...Green Hornet symbol is a double K...meaning high vitamin K content....which leafy greens have) 3. Leeks....I know that Leeks are very cold hardy but I am not sure if I should put leeks at the number 3 cold since leeks seem to have a large temperature range and the ideal soil and air temp may put leeks higher on this list....maybe somewhere from 4 to 6...idk(green and blue heart symbol.....heart for the allium family...as garlic is heart and soul of culinary science....I don't know if I got this right but for some reason I associated leeks with high water content and that's why I have the green and blue....do growing leeks like a lot of water?) 4. Turnip....Another large temperature range yet cold hardy veggie so I am not sure if number 4 would be the best place for Turnips( V for brassica family...V shape cause Kale is a brassica and has rigid V like edges(except for dinosaur kale).....symbol is red and white because Turnips are white and purplish-red) 5. Radish....From what I have researched I think radish has the largest temperature range yet..(Half of a triangle for taproots....red symbol due to the color of the radish....) 6. Head Lettuce(I have buttercrunch)...from what I have research this veggie seems to be the logical next one in order (single K for less vitemin K content but still a leafy green....yellow and green color....yellow for the color of butter) 7. Swiss Chard....next one in line I think?....(Double “green arrow” K...red and white..the color of the swiss flag) 8. Arugula....I really don't know about arugula haven't found much temp info on arugula....(single K for less vit K....black and green....black for pepper since arugula has a peppery flavor to it) 9. Romaine Lettuce....number 9 maybe? ….(single K for less vit K....red and yellow...the color of the Roman flag) 10. Parsley....or Peas or Broccoli or Brussel Sprouts idk...haven't done much herb temperature research yet...(H for low temp herbs....orange and green color...orange because I use parsley on my orange salmon recipe) 11. Cilantro...or Peas or Broccoli or Brussel Sprouts idk..haven't done much herb temperature research yet...(H for low temp herbs...white and red...the color of salsa! Which cilantro is good in) 12. Broccoli...or Brussel Sprouts or Peas?...(V for Brassicas....yellow and green symbol..reason: When brocolli flowers, it's yellow) 13. Brussel Sprouts? (V for Brassicas....yellow and blue symbol..reason: the flag color of Brussels city is yellow and blue) 14. Peas?....(half moon for peas.....half moon all green...cause it looks like a fricken pea...look at the sunglasses) 15. Dill?....put this next since dill is a large temperature range herb....(double H for warm and hot temperature herbs....green and white....the color of pickles + the color of most pickle lids(white)) 16. Basil...next just because I have no idea the order basill should be in...(single H...red and green...red due to basil being a good pizza sauce addition.) 17. Thyme...next just because I have no idea the order basill should be in...(single H...black and white...image of a black hole which has TIME altering properties) 18. Oregano....warmer weather herb....double H for warm and hot temperature herbs...red and green: red because oregano is a good pizza sauce addition) 19. Tomato.....(Circle symbol for fruits- red filled in circle with with white background looks like a slicing tomato)) 20. Cherry Tomato....(Circle symbol for fruits �" purple and red circular symbol...Purple is the color of the stem of a cherry tomato 21. cucumber?.........or beans?...not sure which one requires hotter avg. temps(double Circle symbol for elongated fruits....double circle with Green outer shell + white inner shell representative of colors of cucumber.) 22. beans? Or cucumber...not sure which one requires hotter avg. temps(Crescent moon for beans, nuts,a nd seeds....Green with white background looks like a bean) 23. Peppers(Bell, then jalapeno, then serrano, then cayenne, then habenero)(X, XX, XXX symbols representation for peppers...green single X for bell pepper(color of bell pepper)...green double X for jalapaneo(color of jalapeno)...and so on) 24. Okra?....or melons?....not sure which one...according to slimy okra...this should be last..but other sources have some melons that require hotter temps than Okra(green star for color and shape of Okra)... 25. Canteloupe.....or Okra... according to slimy okra...this should be 2nd to last (Circle symbol for fruits...white inner shell + orange outer shell looks like cantelope) 26. Watermelon.....(circle symbol for fruits........ green outer shell + red inner shell looks like water melon) ???....Cauliflower....not in there yet...but I think it would somewhere between 13- brussel sprouts and 19.. cherry tomatoes) Well thanks for all the advice and help everyone and if you have any temp or order info...or any other info...message back!!

I'm also considering this plant for my yard, and while I don't have any experience with it, the research I've been doing on this species over the past week seems to indicate it can take temperatures into the mid 20s but will defoliate or die back to the ground (but come back up once it warms up). My climate is very similar to yours, maybe just a tad warmer with winter lows ranging from the mid 40s to mid 30s, with drops into the upper 20s on about 1-3 nights a year. Based on what I've read, I feel confident enough the plant would survive the winter here that I would probably buy one if I saw it for sale. Any experience anyone has with this species in the Bay Area (or California in general) would be greatly appreciated though! I think the Spicy Jatropha is the closest thing to Plumerias any of us in California will be able to grow outdoors, haha.

I haven't posted a whole lot here in the past few years. Mainly because I just don't post that much anymore, period. I only have 5 palms left now, including a 5 & 1/2 foot windmill, which I have had for about 5 years. I also moved to a zone 6B/7A in the mountains of far Western Loudoun County, VA. This winter has been harsh. 63.5" of snow on the year here, and many nights at zero F or below, and many days with highs of 5-12 above. The lowest we saw this winter was -9F with 10 nights below zero period, and many many more at 0-5 above. Today even, 3/26/14, after 3 more inches of snow yesterday, our high has been 27F. It should be about 55 by now! Suffice it to say even in its protected location on the south side of the house up against it in full sun, my windmill is FRIED, completely. However, the spear is still as snug as ever. If it has made it through this winter, it will be making a trip to Smithfield, VA to my partners mothers house and being planted there in her front yard. I suppose the next couple months will tell if it has in deed weathered what has been the harshest winter in 20+ years here.

Here are some pics I took this morning. We broke the low temperature record set in 1970 this morning. Here's a Black Sapote on the NW side of my house. It sits under a large oak so that has been some benefit. It has been left uncovered this entire cold snap. The trunk is wrapped however. It is wilted with some tender growth and leaves blackened, but by and large it performed much better than I had expected. Here are my bananas. The banana in the center (that looks like all the other ones) was sprayed with Freeze Pruf. Here is my Glenn mango next to an 8' ladder. I had to tie the branches back in order to get it to fit inside the frost cloth: My Jaboticaba seems to have done very well in this cold snap (and did well during last year's cold too): All in all it looks like my tropicals/sub-tropicals will be fine. I have some damage on my Areca palms, my Carpentaria palms, my Panama Rose, etc. My pineapples look fine (maybe 5% damage). My black bamboo (Gigantochloa atroviolacea) has about 10% freeze damage (mainly on the smaller, thinner growth). I will have some minor limb dieback on my mangos, and my Muntingia tree (Strawberry tree) looks pretty sad but should be o.k. It is not very tall because the past two years raccoons have climbed it and snapped the tree in half: