Me too! I was waiting for you to post this.

There is a lady on the Cooking Forum, 'grain lady' that has lots of info regarding grains and the mills.

Dawn,
I'll be interested to see the responses also. Why? Because as I'm sure I mentioned I also buy and sell antques. And several have bought grinders from me to use. In fact I just saw a grain mill sell yesterday. And think there is another selling today as I'm leaving in a few minutes. Many of the old grinders say grain mill on them. But I've had people buy coffee grinders to use for some grains. So interested to see what they use and also how fine they grind or if they crimp. From my sales it seems that many grind wheat and corn and crimp oats, barley, ect. But just curious what the pros on here do. Jay

I'll have to check out "grain lady", because I'd like to know where I can buy certified organic grains,(NO GMO stuff). One listing has it, but not locally. Must cost a fortune to ship in 50 to 100lb lots.

Barbara

Here is a link that might be useful: Home Grown Harvest

"supposedly" I can grind grain in my Vita-Mix. Has anyone ever tried it?
I, too am thinking about getting a mill.

I was delighted this morning to locate wheat berries pretty close....the Seymour, MIssouri area. It is a Mennonite owned store, Byler Supply and Country Store. I knew if anyone would have them, plus lots of bread making supplies, like the SAF yeast and 7-grain mix, it would the the Ammish or Mennonite stores. I wasn't even aware we had one close by.They have them in 25 lb and 50 lbs bags. The red and white wheat berries are $27.86 in paper bags. That means you would have to locate some food safe 5 gallon buckets with seal tight lids.

Hello, ceresone! Maybe you can grow some dent corn in one of those raised beds and do your own cornmeal. I am getting excited about all this. I think I have DH convinced.

I have 6 loaves of bread raising right now....a new recipe.
Unfortunately, it is just made with Hodgsden Mills flours.
I have been seeing an ad on Craig's List for freshly ground flours at a nearby town. She is charging $l per pound.

The mill I kept reading about on the Cooking forum was the Nutrimill Grain Mill. Pleasant Hill Grain has them on sale now for around $240. I don't know anyone personally who has one.

Here is a link that might be useful: Grain Mill

I have a K-Tec and it works great but I have broken one of the plastic clips that snaps the top to the bottom. It grinds very nice and looks OK on the counter. I like the product, but don't like the company. I contacted them to see if I could get the outside plastic replaced and they told me it would be $90 plus shipping. Since it doesn't leak flour without it, I have just not had it replaced. For $90, I probably never would. I think I paid $235 for it originally. I have seen the same mill for less recently. Mine is probably 15 years old. Prior to this one I had a Magic Mill. It was metal, but very heavy and had a separate bucket that fit on it to catch the grain. The hole in the bucket was not at the right height for the mill so I always had to set it on a trivet to get a tight fit. I would not buy that type again.

I lived in Colorado when I bought the first one and didn't have any trouble finding one. When I bought the second one, I lived in southern Oklahoma and searched all over OKC for one. Finally, I sent the money to my daughter in Utah and she picked it up at the company for me. I had her children for the summer and we met in Denver and I got the mill and she got the kids back. LOL

When I got home and opened the mill, I found that the knob that sets the grind size wouldn't hold tight. Then I found a price tag on it that said ZCMI so I know it was a return that they had sold to her as a new mill for a new price. I was not happy about that, then when I contacted them for a repair and they quoted $90, I had another reason to be unhappy.

Now, the worse part of the story is this. After I tried all over OK to find one, then got it from Utah, I walked into the little health food store in Ardmore and there was one just like it for $20 less. I shopped in that shop at least once a month and had never noticed that they had a grain mill in the case. It was so different than the old metal one I had, that I didn't recognize that it was a grain mill until I bought one just like it. I don't know if the store is still there, but it was at the hospital, right across from the heli-pad. I know they have built some new buildings up there, so I don't know if it still exists.

I have a hand operated one also, but it is just emergency backup.

Some of the newer ones will grind beans also but mine is not recommended for that, and the opening for the grain to go down is just large enough for corn. Grinding corn is loud. I had a friend who liked to thicken all of her stews and soups with ground beans. They cook fairly quickly when they are ground and do make a hearty soup addition.

I am glad you asked this question, because when I look at their Warranty, it says that the Chamber and Pan are warranted for "Lifetime". I think I will be calling them again. The motor in mine is still perfect, it the outside things I have had trouble with.

Here is a company that sells this mill and several others. If I were buying again, I would buy through a retailer then if something was wrong maybe the retailer would carry a little more weight in getting good service. Walton Feed is a good company.

Here is a link that might be useful: Grinder

I have a Country Living Grain Mill and love it. I also bought the bean & corn auger but I've yet to try them.

We bought a few hundred pounds of wheat through a group bulk buy about a year ago and picked it up while on a trip to save shipping. Not sure where we'll buy from next time. The LDS stores sell it, both in person and online. I haven't looked recently enough to remember how much it sells for but, if all else fails, it's a reliable option.

Here is a link that might be useful: Country Living Grain Mill

You do know someone who has a Nutrimill because it's me. On Grainlady's advice, I bought one and I have used it three times. I like it very much. The woman who runs the bakery in downtown Bartlesville has four of them that she uses daily. She says they are very dependable. I have two manual grain mills, but it's a lot of work to grind enough wheat to make a couple loaves of bread!

I was glad to hear about the Byler store in Seymour MO. That is 40 miles closer, for me than Buyer Direct Foods in Atchison, KS. Here's their website address:
www.farmerdirectfoods.com

We went all the way to Marienthal KS last springand bought 100 pounds, in paper bags, and also some rye. I was going to get spelt, too, but they were out. Since that time I found out about Farmer Direct Foods but I've not been there. You can also get wheat from the Oklahoma Food Co-op, but that requires a membership and I don't find the prices for most of their other stuff to be very competititive. Here's that website: www.oklahomafood.coop

There's also an organic wheat farm called "Cattletracks LLC" in Fairview, OK. They sell their wheat through the co-op or you can buy it direct from them. They pack their wheat in poly buckets but I don't think they are food grade because they do not have the knife and fork symbol on them anywhere. This is hard red winter wheat and the protein is lower than that which you will get in Atchison or Marienthal. Glenda, do you know what the protein level is of the wheat that you can get in Seymour? Probably high enough, since the Mennonites there use it for their breads.

You can also buy wheat berries at Farmer's Co-ops that are located in several towns. There is one at Ark City, KS and their sister store is in Newkirk, OK. The wheat is not organic and the protein level is not real high, but they told me at the one in Ark City that a lot of people buy the grain from them to use to make their bread with, and the folks at the mill there in Ark City told me they buy their wheat from them. I would think for flour made of that wheat, you would need to add extra gluten. I have to add extra gluten to the grain from Cattletracks. This is what my friend who owns the bakery recommended that I do.

If any of you find other sources for wheat that can be driven to, please chime in, as the shipping is higher than the cost of the wheat when you can't go pick it up yourself.

Our local Atwoods was selling chopped corn to be used as feed. I thought about getting some to grind, but the fact that it was chopped stopped me. It was in paper bags and you don't know how long it's sat in the warehouse or under what conditions. I have no place to grow dent corn so if anyone knows local sources for that I'd like to know.

Ilene, here is the info on the store in Seymour, Mo.
Phone Numbers: 800-795-2995 AND (417) 935-4522.
There are lots of Amish/Mennonites in the area. There is where I bought my chicken house made by Amish. It is a dandy.

Here are the directions given to me....driving from Springfield, Mo.

2-1/2 miles east of Seymour on highway 60, then 1/4 mile north. The man I talked to told me it is located behind the salvage yard...to be looking for that.
He carries Prairie Gold White and Bronze Chief Red...those are the only two I enquired about; might have other grains.

Glenda

Ilene, When you get to Seymour you are almost to Baker Creek Heirloom seeds.

Glenda, I noticed that they had lots of chicken houses, storage sheds, greenhouses, etc. in the town of Seymour. They were closed when we went through in both directions but we did stop and look over the fence at a few things. They normally build very good things so I would bet you got a good chicken house.

I feel a road trip coming on! Is Baker Creek open all year long? When do they start putting out their seed for the coming growing season?

I couldn't begin to leave my garden right now. But maybe late winter / REALLY early spring would be an option. Right now, I have enough wheat berries to last me for awhile.

That brings me to another thought -- there's a Mennonite community in Choteau (near Wagoner). They have a restaurant there and I think there's a Mennonite furniture store. I wonder if a little wandering around there would be productive? That's not far from me.

I looked longingly at that greenhouse. It had built-in everything and was already wired. Seems like it was around $2000, so I didn't get it. I still plan to use up all the old storm windows and build one!

The Mennonites are a pretty close community. Call one of the stores and ask if they have one of the country stores. I am betting they do.

Would you believe I have never been to Baker Creek. I did visit Hogsdon Mills to buy the white wheat flower direct a couple of years ago since our stores don't carry it. We took a drive a week or so ago and went back....the mill is closed. I hate the economy!

Here is the link to Baker Creek. Email them or give them a call. I know they have a Sunday thing all year, but the Mennonite stores won't be open then.

http://rareseeds.com/about/

Ilene, Baker Creek is open all year, but they are not open on Saturdays. They have a festival the first Sunday of every month. There web site says two different things, but I believe they do it every month. On that day, vendors come in and sell other things. When I was there, the first week of September, they had a lot of empty seed bins, but they were having a sale, so I made out like a bandit. Some of the seeds were marked for 2010, so I think they just put them out as they get them. Most of mine were for 2009, but I think everything I bought should be good for a couple of years since I didn't buy onions or things like that with a short life span.

Baker Creek is near the town of Mansfield MO.

I hope you are better at resisting than I am. I have kind of wanted chickens, but was afraid my neighbors were too close. Finally I decided to get some little ones anyway. Now, I couldn't get something practical that would lay lots of eggs. Instead I bought these ornamental chicks that are adorable. I have seven young ones in a little modified cage right now. I must built a chicken tractor or chicken coop this week. I don't even know how many are hens, so by the time I can tell, I may not have many that I want to keep. LOL They are sultans and are quite rare. I guess you can say I have joined the "pet chicken" class. They are extremly quite, fun to watch, and their manure will be a nice addition for the garden. How's that for jutification? My husband wants me to buy some "real" chickens also. Ones that really lay eggs. LOL

Here is a link that might be useful: Baker Creek Monthly Festival

All of you who live close enough to drive to Baker Creek are so lucky! I am just green with envy.

I'm not really close enough to anything nearly as interesting as Baker Creek, but when I we lived in Fort Worth, I could drive west about an hour to Willhite Seed. It's just a distribution center and nothing fancy to see, but driving there enabled me to get the seeds I wanted that day instead of waiting for them to be shipped.

We are going on a brief car trip tomorrow or Tuesday to the D-FW Metroplex to visit the Pendery Spice store. I want to buy some spices in bulk there because they are so much cheaper in bulk. I could order them online and have them shipped, but this gives me a good excuse to drive down and then visit other places there that I like and miss visiting like Marshall Grain Company. I am sure y'all know exactly what kind of trip this will be. It will be one of those "As long as we're here, I want to go to ________" trips.

Since we are going to be down there anyway (LOL), I'll "have to" stop at Marshall Grain, Central Market, Town Talk, Whole Foods and Green Sprouts....plus any other place that strikes my fancy. I think I'd better make a list or I'll forget something that I want to do while down there.

Carol,

I bet the Sultans are just adorable. We have our "real" chickens in the chicken coop/big fenced chicken run and they are a nice mix--Buff Orpingtons, Ameracaunas, Lakenvelders, Welsummers, etc. These are our working girls and their roosters. We get lots of eggs from them.

In the smaller chicken coop/fenced run we have a mix of banty hens and they basically are pet chickens. My favorites are the Black Polish Silkies with White Crests, but we have silkies in several other colors and all are adorable. Then, we have a few other types of banties including some impossibly small ones with feathered feet. Those little bitty banties haven't laid any eggs, but if they did, they'd probably be about the size of a robin egg.

Chickens are wonderful company. I hope someday we'll be able to let them out to free-range again, but that probably won't happen until next spring and only if we don't keep having predator issues.

Dawn

I'm surprised your Silkies don't lay. I thought they were good layers and also broody. I guess I need to read that again. I love silkies, but they almost don't look like chickens. I read somewhere that when they were introduced in England, they claimed they were part chicken, part rabbit. LOL They had silkies in pens at Baker Creek, but I didn't see any for sale. Of course, I wasn't really looking for chickens.

Sultans are supposed to be calm, but mine are still pretty easily freightened. I started yesterday picking them up to pet them. They are fine once you get them in your hands and they seem to enjoy being stroked, but will still try to run if you reach down for one. The lady I bought them from said she kept them mixed with the rest of her flock (not recommended on-line) and her small child could reach down and pick up the rooster. I think the reason they scare so easily is eyesite. They don't see you until you are very close, then they think they are in danger. When all of those feathers are fully developed it has to block even more visibility for them.

I'm no chicken expert, but I have been around them some. My parents always had chickens, and I had chickens when I lived near Lake Thunderbird. I have never seen chickens that behave like these. They all do everything at the same time. If one of them picks up something off the ground, then they all want it and chase after that one, and if one eats, then they all eat. They have food in their feeder most of the time, but when I fill it up they all rush to it like they haven't eaten for a week. They have five toes like the silkies do. They have a roost in their little pen, but they use it to play on in the daytime and at night they all cuddle up together on the ground to sleep. They behave more like ground birds. I am afraid that I am going to end up with several roosters although I can't tell for sure yet. Three seem to be developing tail feathers that stand up a little higher than the others. One morning I saw one upon the roost and was acting like he was trying to crow, but not a sound came out. He tried it several times before giving up. The lady that I got them from said they were the quietest of her chickens and that really seems to be right. I have had them 4 weeks and one was just a hatchling, but the others were various ages so I kind of have all sizes right now and all they do is chirp like a baby chick. I have not been in a hurry to build them a coop because I think they have different requirements than most chickens. I think they need a nice warm floor to sleep on and I don't think they need a lot of space.

I have found something that I think I will build for chickens, but I may build something different for these since they don't act much like chickens. LOL

Carol,

My Silkies may yet start laying. They are only 5 months old, but the bigger chickens have been laying a month or more. I have heard that Sultans sometimes do lay eggs, but often not until they are around a year old and even then they are very inconsistent layers.

I do love the Silkies. They are so adorable--they look like they belong in a movie with The Muppets.

Your Sultans sound so cute! I love the way they do every thing together.

We ended up with 5 roosters out of 24 birds, and that is at least 4 roosters too many. I love hearing the crowing, but sometimes they all crow simultaneously and it can be quite a racket. They have not begun fighting much among themselves and I am glad they haven't. One of the Welsummer roosters is clearly the largest of all the roosters by a mile, and I'm pretty sure none of the smaller roosters will challenge him.
There are so many cute designs out there nowadays for chicken housing. I am sure your birds will be happy in whatever you build for them.

Dawn

I have read a lot of different things on the Sultans, but laying doesn't seem to be their strong suit. One lady said hers lay every other day and another said once a week. I'm not sure it matters, I just want them.

I assume you bought females but got 5 males mixed in. Is that right?

There are some really cute coops and chicken tractors, as well as some very expensive things to buy. Mine will never be able to run free, but I am thinking of small pen, which includes a roost, a nest box, and an enclosed area for winter, but a wire pen on bottom. Out of necessity it will have to have a wire floor, but I want to make it so I can add a run without a floor for daytime. I will also make it lightweight so it can be moved as needed. I think it might be easier to build two different types rather than try to meet the needs of the working girls as well as these little ornamentals.

I have read that the silkies just love to be motherly and are used to hatch lots of other bird eggs, like duck, geese, quail, and pheasant. The sultans are not known to be good mothers like the silkies.

We sure took this grain thread to the chickens, didn't we. Well, they do eat grain.

and here I'm envying you, going to the spice store--and I live only about 40 miles from Baker Creek, only been there twice.
And I've only looked at the buildings at Seymour.

I would love to have some laying hens, if I could provide a safe place for them-and a snake free environment. Is that possible? Also, they would all have to die of old age, because I am quite positive I wouldn't be able to butcher them. My parents had chickens when I was growing up, but that was then, and this is now, and just me, lol!

Barbara

Carol,

We bought some pullets and also some straight run. Most of the straight run birds turned out to be roosters.

It has been hysterically funny. If you think listening to one young rooster trying to figure out how to crow is funny, just multiply it by 5. They all can crow pretty well now but for a while it was just pitiful. Now that they've figured out the whole crowing thing, they are working really hard on crowing in unison.

So far, they get along and aren't fighting. One of the Welsummer roosters is clearly the alpha male, and as long as the others respect that, they may not fight very much. The bad thing about having roosters is that they start crowing around 3-5 a.m. and I am a light sleeper. These roosters are kind of sweet. Every other rooster we've had in the past had to be taught that if you spur the human, you get kicked in the head. (They learn fast.) These roosters haven't even tried to spur a human. Hooray--civilized roosters!

We're getting oodles of eggs, and one hen is acting like she might go broody and sit on the nest, but it is getting late in fall for her to start that because it would be cold when the chicks hatch out. So, we'll probably continue gathering the eggs and then let her set on a clutch of eggs in the spring.

Barb,

It is not at all hard to build a secure coop/run. There are photos and plans all over the internet. With a chicken run, what has worked for us is having it fenced on all sides, including the ground and the top, so they can't fly out and predators can't fly in, dig in, climb in or jump in.

If the coop has predator proof doors that are closed every night, they'll be fine.

Snakes are sometimes a problem here, and we kill every one that comes into the chicken coop. Tim tried catching and releasing chicken/rat snakes against my will, and they always came back, usually within 24 hours, so now they all get shot. We've had one snake take out a half-dozen chicks in one day, so we keep chicks in a brooder cage made of 1/4" hardware cloth until they are 3/4s grown.

This year we have had exactly one snake in the chicken coop, and it didn't do any harm, so it has been a very good year in that regard.

Check out some of the chicken housing on the link. I bet at least one of your sons is handy enough to help you build one.

Dawn

Here is a link that might be useful: Chicken Coop Designs

Dawn
Thanks for that link!
The ideas seem to be unlimited, and so many of them are really cute. I'd have to see what my neighborhood would tolerate, and not squawk about, lol!

My son is already saying, "oh no! Here we go again!"
I know he'd make pets of them tho, just like he does everything else. We can't help ourselves! That's why I said they'd have to die of old age.

Back to the wheat berry and corn grain discussion. If anyone knows of a place in the OKC area that sells good clean organic wheat and corn for grinding, PLEASE let me know. My son could pick some up on one of his visits. Otherwise, as you know the shipping is more than the cost of the grain.

BTW, oddly enough, on one of the grinder sites, they said a good ten speed blender will grind wheat. I've used my blender to grind some pretty gnarly stuff, even corn, but it's too hard on the blender.
Thanks,
Barbara

Barbara, Wheat isn't nearly as hard to grind as corn, and not half as noisy.

I have looked at chicken tractors for months and here is a good sight with pictures that are a little larger and easier to see.

Here is a link that might be useful: The City Chicken

This is my favorite design so far, and I think I will build a version of this one for the real chicks. Atwoods had babies today on special for $1.99 so I had to indulge and bought five. They are spending the night inside tonight, so I have to do something soon. I don't even know what kind I have but they are heavier breed pullets. After they grow a little maybe I can tell what they are. Two are solid black and the other three are brown. I think there are 3 breeds total.

I will probably build one of the triangular shaped pens for the Sultans. They seem to like being together and so far they don't seem interested in a roost and some of them are older chicks. I have a box in the pen with wood shavings in it and they would be nice and warm if they would go in it, but instead they all cuddle together on the ground. They play in the box all day. After I build a coop, I am sure that I will have to lock them in the top so they get the idea. They are also not very cold hardy so I will probably build it so I can heat it on the coldest nights. I think I can leave some clear floor space as well as a roost area in that shape. These chickens don't get very big anyway. I only have 7 now and I don't know how many I will have when I am able to determine their gender. I hope I didn't get 7 roosters. LOL I would love to keep one rooster with them but if it is loud I won't be able to do that. I guess I shouldn't worry too much since my neighbors don't worry if their dog barks under my window all night. Actually I like the neighbor and the dog but some nights I have to tell him to shut up and go back into the house. LOL Most of our neighbors take good care of their pets, but a few just let them roam free and poop in everyone elses yard and I don't like that.

The lady I bought the Sultans from at Baker Creek, told me that even the roosters aren't loud. We will see.

Dawn, If you want to go to Baker Creek, just drive here and spend the night and we will make a road trip. From your house to mine is about five hours or a little more. We can get up early the next day and drive over, then come back before night time. You could dirve home the next day and have no motel bills for the trip. All you need is a 3 day period when you can get away from home. I'm serious.

Here is a link that might be useful: chicken tractor

They have very similar ones where I bought mine at Seymour, Mo. Looks like a good design.

I bought the 6x12 version with half enclose coop with two windows and nests and half open wired in yard; all under roof.
It is on skids so can be moved...but would be quite a job.

It is currently housing 10 birds.

Carol,

Thanks for the invitation and I'll keep it in mind. Visiting Baker Creek is on my list of things to do before I die. LOL

Maybe your black hens are Black Australorps. They are wonderful, gentle chickens and, once they start laying eggs, they don't miss a day. Mine used to follow me around the yard, a-digging and a-scratching and a-clucking all day long. They had the sweetest personalities and seemed to enjoy human companionship a great deal.

We had a big chicken party today. I was making apple pie jam and carried the apple peel and cores out to the chickens instead of to the compost pile (it will end up on the compost pile eventually). The chickens had a wild apple-eating party and are the happiest I've seen them in a while. They get kitchen scraps a lot, but apples are one of their favorites, so if there is such a thing as deliriously happy chickens, that's what we have here today.

Dawn