Okay, now you've done it, Whitegarden. I'm going to insist that after our New England Gardening Forum trip to Logee's greenhouse this month, we plan a spring trip to White Flower...

They have a website too, you know, so even if your "real" catalogue isn't next to you while you're on the computer, you can conveniently browse their wares online. heehee

Cady,
I would be busy perusing catalogs but I have not been able to stop reading "Gardening at the Shore" by Frances Tenenbaum, it not only has quotes from gwer's but a section "Advice from Seashore Gardeners" highlighting garden experts. I am finding the advise from one particular garden designer who discusses the use of bamboo and grasses in the seaside garden very interesting. kt

I'd second the Cady's idea about trip to WWF on one condition only:
everyone should left his/her credit cards home and take only enough cash to fill the tank to get back home.
WWF is not just overpriced, but extremely overpriced by all counts.

There are three major time-attractions at WWF,
early-mid May------spring bulbs,
mid-end of June-early July-----280' long Christopher Lloyd inspred border in its full summer glory,
late August-early-mid September for the fall colors in the same border plus grasses.

Ahh, George, don't forget the Begonia house in early-mid June. Short of Antonelli's in California, I don't think there's anything like it anywhere.

Agree about pricing, wholeheartedly, but sometimes there are things ou can't find elsewhere locally. So, I bring $50 cash AND the gas money. LOL

Martie

Oh, I love the begonia house. I can't seem to grow begonias. They rot on me every time. I don't think I'm over watering but must be. Anyway, it's just as well 'cause I can't afford the prices of their fancy English ones anyway.

Tricia

Ahhhrrrr! Busted! Kt, yep, I'm in the book. lol. You know, I first "met" author Frances Tennenbaum right on GardenWeb when she went to the Northeast Coastal Gardening forum looking for gardener with oceanside experience. We went back and forth, and I ended up sending her notes she could refer to. You've probably seen that she cites GardenWeb in sidebars in the book, and quotes members. Her approach was very smart, to draw on the experiences of everyday gardeners and small-scale professionals like me. So easy for other gardeners-readers to relate to, like chatting on the forums. Ms. Tennenbaum is also a charming and very intelligent laddy. It was fun to meet and "talk shop" with her.

George, at least anyone who has seen at WFF catalogue knows that their prices are sky-high. But the DF (Drool Factor) is too high to ignore after you've seen the photos. I'd recommend what you said about leaving the plastic at home... but instead of bringing just gas money (which one could still slip up with and spend on one perfect bulb), maybe we should suggest that everyone buy a non-refundable bus ticket in advance, like they do in those casino package tours... the ones where you pay for your round-trip bus ticket, meals and hotels and they WON'T give you cash back for the return ticket so you are forced to have transporation home if you blow your $$ at the casino.

Ack! I have a problem with using too many consonents! I meant to spell "Tenenbaum" and "lady" -- not "Tennenbaum" and "laddy"! Sorry about all the other typos and glitches too. I really wish we had spell check on GardenWeb. :(

I really enjoy visiting WFF - don't care if their plants are overpriced, I won't buy much from them. The catalog was my first glimpse into "another way" of looking at gardening, and I like placing an occasional order just so it will keep coming.

I word of caution: I've had some pretty bad experiences with some of the plants that are found only at WFF. Be sure to check up on these plants at a reliable reference site (like MOBOT.org) before falling in love with a photo or description in the catalog. Among my regrets: sweet autumn clematis and Eupatorium 'chocolate', which are both invasive here, and several viburnum, including ones that grew far larger than described and ones with grafts that failed within a year after planting.

Still, it's a wonderful catalog, and a very nice place to visit. I even like their plants - best picked up, not mail-ordered.

So, let's go!

DTD,
What plants in particular are you speaking of? I didn't think that Eupatorium 'Chocolate' and sweet autumn clematis were WFF exclusives; I've found those plants at a number of sources.

But I have seen WFF feature a new cultivar in their online and paper catalogues and claim that they are WFF exclusives. Sometimes I think they buy the first rights to sell a new variety, but don't put it in their test garden first to give it a trial run.

Yes, these are widely available now, but that wasn't the case when I bought them - probably 18 years ago for S.A.C. - and it was not available anywhere else at the time as far as I know; or not anyplace else that I knew about then.

The oversized viburnum was labelled as a compact variety, and unfortunately I don't recall the details although it was a doublefile. I don't know if that was a proverbial mix-up in the nursery, or a sport, or a worker filling an order with a substitution when something was out of stock; I suspect the first, though.

The failed graft was also viburnum, V. carlcephalum. I've still got these, they are lovely, but the rootstock will eventually take over, since they throw suckers every year.

I have lots of plants that I love dearly that are from WFF. Now that there is so much more variety in my local nurseries, and now that I've found Forestfarm and Bluestone, though, I don't fall in love with everything I see in the WFF catalog.

Goes to show how quickly things get mainstreamed! I've had Eupatorium 'Chocolate' for around five years, and think I got some of them at Home Depot. lol

It's understandable that glitches happen when you're dealing with the volume that WFF likely does. But again, I wonder whether, in their rush to get a horticultural
"exclusive scoop" on a new variety, they fail to test the integrity and habit of the plants for themselves, in their own experimental gardens. It's risky to reserve a lot of an unknown new type, taking only the grower's word for it that the plant has a certain habit (sometimes the grower doesn't even know what he has, because the variety is ... new!), then sell it to the world while touting the marketing lingo.

I've been disappointed, for example, with Ray Evison's Garland series of clematis, which were marketed as having been specially bred to flourish indoors. I have yet to see one that comes through the winter with flying colors, despite pampering.

Guess we all need to take the new variety PR with a grain of salt. I'll just let other people buy it first, and find out how it performed for them.

That aside, I still want to go to WFF and see the Lloyd border!

Got my catalog last week. Have a long list of plants I am pining for from WFF. I have never been there, but I am going to put it on the calendar and hope that I can make it there this spring. It sounds really lovely.

:-)

Over the years I have learned never to say "never" about any nursery but wff has disappointed me with expensive new introductions more than once. The most recent occasion was with the sunrise-set series of coneflowers when they arrived I was shocked to see they had shipped me seedlings far, far, too young to have left the stability of their greenhouse. When I called wff laid the blame on the grower and refunded me for the purchase. Needless to say the little seedlings didn't even live long enough to provide my slugs with much more than an appetizer.

Just a quiet suggestion to explore the on-line Lazy S'S Farm Nursery catalog. Fair prices. Quality. Unusual varieties.

I guess I need to visit WFF! No, I don't actually "buy" much from them. I just drool over the catalog and then order plants from my nursery. I guess if there was something I absolutely had to have that was only available there, I would consider it. But I try not to get tempted by the oh so new and different. They always seem to be a disappointment in the NE garden. I try to stick with more tried and true in nice quantity!

WG

I don't order from them either [g] their prices are high, but I would like to visit them and see their display gardens and what they have available in person.

WFF does indeed have a gorgeous catalog, and I love to look through it. I have never bought any plants from them, though - as most agree, their prices are just too high. I do like to get ideas from the catalog though.

The closest I've come to visiting is driving by - twice! Each time, the person I was with (both non-gardeners) had absolutely no interest in stopping. So we drove by, me with my nose pressed against the glass, watching the nursery pass by out of sight...

:)
Dee

I was really hoping to work on my plant addiction this year, but when I got the WFF catalog, I didn't throw it in the recycle pile like I was supposed to. Instead I studied every page and marked lots and lots and lots of plants that caught my attention. I guess it came at just the right time.

I was thinking I might cut out the pics and descriptions of the ones that got me and keep them in my purse when cruising garden centers. Or maybe give a list of them to some local garden centers where I am a familiar face to see if they can get them.

One thing that I am coming to learn after doing this for awhile now, is that the really worthy plants will rise to the surface and eventually show up in HD or Lowes.

I went to WFF once many many years ago before I was really into gardening and plants. You won't believe what I bought there that day! I recently ran across it when cleaning out my plant index card file and was shocked! Stella Dora daylily! Ohmigod

Thanks for the heads up on 'exclusive'. Normally that would enable me, but now I know it might be marketing-speak for untested!

I'd never heard of nandina's suggestion, so I googled it. It has a good rating at the Garden Watchdog.

Garden Watchdog

Claire

Here is a link that might be useful: LazyS's Farm Nursery

That was a funny story Dee. I have been in that situation on a couple of occasions. I know just how you felt. [g]

Here is a link to Garden Watchdog's page on White Flower Farm.

Here is a link that might be useful: WFF review on Garden Watchdog

Since we are on the subject. :-)

I was just looking over Garden Watchdog and bringing up lists of catalogs for various things. Seeds mostly. I find it a valuable resource and my own experiences seem to be in line with those I looked up. I have to confess though, that I haven't taken the time to add comments to the companies listed there. I think companies that are doing a good job should be rewarded and when companies either can't or won't deliver, I really want to know about it before I waste my time/money ordering from them.

I think it will be as valuable a resource as we make it, so I am going to spend some time there this week, adding my experiences to the comments. Who knows, maybe some companies could actually make changes if they are more aware of how their customers are experiencing shopping there. Thankfully some companies don't have anything to change!

OH, and I was also thinking, that too often, I never think about the seed company after I receive delivery. I don't often write down how the plants actually turn out from what seed company. I hope...that this year, I will be able to keep better track. Really, how the plants grow and whether they are the right color and are as vigorous as you want them, and whether they look like the photo on the website...those are just as important as whether the prices are fair and shipping is fast.

pm2

Living as I do about 10 minutes from WFF, and having had at best mixed results with their mail order plants, I now limit myself to hitting their annual tent sale in late June (lots of perennials for $2, bareroot plants were $1 two years ago, $2 this past year). I bought 3 bareroot red Osier dogwoods that were 3-4 feet tall for $5 each -- and they are doing magnificently. Had superb luck with the heirloom tomatoes they had at their "Tomatomania" last spring, too. I don't buy anything at full price there because I agree that they are overpriced, but it is worth a trip (bring your patience, walking shoes -- you may have to park a half mile away! -- and a friend to guard your haul while you go retrieve your car!) to their tent sale. I don't feel as badly if something doesn't make it if I've only spent a dollar or two on it. They also have a lot of garden supplies on clearance under the tent. (Note that lots of the bareroot perennials sold at this affair should in fact be planted in early spring ... not late June ... but everything I've bought has survived despite being planted in the heat of summer. I was especially thrilled with the red-twigs, which I was looking for anyway.) And I do love visiting their display gardens -- gives a good sense of how the plants actually look when they're growing (how tall, floppy, wide, etc.). Just my two cents...

ooh, goodness, ctlady! I've heard about their sale - you are a brave woman, lol! I don't know if I'd be up to that. From what I hear it is absolutely packed, busy to the point of chaotic - but as you've said, you can get some good bargains.

Dee

That sounds like the sale at NEWFS in the spring. I went once and that was enough for me. I'd rather pay full price then torture myself ...lol I'm not even sure if the NEWFS has sale prices or if it is just opening day. But I am low energy, so for someone who is high energy, it sounds like a great time.

:-)

The White Flower Farm catalog is good, but I finished that last week. Today I got the Plant Delights catalog! Be still my heart ..... I don't think my credit card is going to survive this one.

Claire

And, Joy Creek is here! Tis the season to be jolly, and forget that other season that we just squeaked through ... whatever it was ... I can't remember.

Fa la la la la, la la la la.

Seneca Hill cataloque just arrived today.
No pics, and...it is like reading a mystery book, every 2 out of the 3 plants I have to google.
Very interesting to read and very depressing as well to realize how little you know...

I've been to WFF quite a few times and I love wandering around through their borders. I have bought plants there and have had good luck, but usually do try to get them on sale. I might have paid full price for a few things over the years, but only if I don't see that plant anywhere else in my travels.

I've also been to their large tent sale about 4x in the past. I love it. Once I went alone, then I learned better and now I drag hubby with me to help with the loot (I treat him to a nice lunch afterwards). We even brought our own wagon last year, but someone walked off with it for a while when we went into a greenhouse and left it unattended-got it back no problem. We get there about 5-10 minutes before the sale starts. It's crowded, but it's not as bad as holiday time at the mall or Saturday at Walmart LOL!!! We scope out the garden products/non-plant items under the tent first b/c that is what sells out the quickest, then off to the greenhouse with the $1 or $2 annuals (Colocasia 'Black Magic', rex begonias, Coleus, Fuchsias, etc). Outside the greenhouses, lots of small pots of perennials were on sale for $2-some unusual ones also. One year I bought a bunch of my coworkers pots of Geranium 'Rozanne' for $2 apiece. That was fun.

Here are a few photos from September 2005. There are a few more in the album I linked to.

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Here is a link that might be useful: WFF in fall

I miss the winter store. It used to be a tradition to drive out in January to get Jasmine and place a small Begonia tuber order. A funny story about one such trip .....

One year I was there with a friend who worked there weekends. When she walked in it was like Norm going in to Cheers. There was an obviously highbrow woman perusing the books (moment of silence for the loss of that section) who immediately skirted over and said "Well, you may work here but I AM A RELATIVE OF AMOS PETTINGILL." We all looked and I'm surprised no one's tongues bled while being bitten.

But back to business: IMHO, WFF put mail order gardening on the retail map. As a teenager it was a place to go work if you didn't want to work in the tobacco fields. The owners were fair and concerned for their customers, and I believe they still are, albeit in abstentia. Many, many good growers nationwide attribute their livelihood to WFF's foresight in knowing they can't grow everything, nor trial everything. Thus, references to growers are acceptable in this case. Yes, they should trial, but they count on an extensive network of home gardeners to do that for them.

And one other small gripe: When David Austin rose first came out, WFF was a distributor. In Z5 DA's can be fickle, and I clearly remember a very aggressive salesperson talking a novice gardener into trying one of these "exclusive" plants. IMHO, again, if a vendor claims it is "exclusive" it shouldn't be available anywhere else. Period.

I'd go on a trip to WFF just because it's WFF. The queen of garden centers in CT.

Martie