For some folks its no big thing anymore, I got it from 1 normal looking plant from Mississippi I got in the spring. It was the only plant that came from the south and showed signs first. Winter is coming, it will be gone, and I'll be buying no more plants from the south for spring delivery. Why is he still selling plants? Because he really doesn't care if you get it or not from him. It is unresponsible for him not to tell people he has it and can't control it.

I think he should at least list it in his description on the auction that he has rust. In my area, we don't have hard winters as a general rule so it would be a big problem for me.

Dianne

I agree with you, Dianne. Many trust worthy sellers do make notes in their description regarding having had rust in their gardens and what precautions they are currently taking. I am a hobbiest, not a grower, and have ahout 50 named cultivars and a few seedlings. I understand how difficult it is to control rust. I have a regular spraying program with two different (expensive!!) fungicides and still have an occasional outbreak. Typically, it is confined to one or two plants and I start stripping leaves as soon as I see it and then hit it with a contact fungicide. I have been keeping records though, and when I find that a specific plant continues to be a problem for rust, regardless of what it cost me, it goes into the trash - - not into the compost since I don't know if the heat of normal composting is high enough to kill the spores.
Larry - - near Augusta, GA

Many sellers on LA do state they have had rust,have a spraying program in place,and if you are concerned ,do not bid.I bought,I got,I hope to get rid.Next year will tell if it is winter killed or not.I am ordering nothing for spring shipping.BTW the culprit was Raspberry Winter.It seems to be rather succeptible to rust from a few things I have read.

Betsy

This is a tough question and my opinion has changed over the years, but this person is being truthful in telling you they have rust.

IMO, the odds are, that if you buy a plant from a southern garden, it will have been exposed to rust and may be carrying it.

If the seller has a spray program in place, the rust may be suppressed, even in a susceptible plant, but still present. When you get the plant, if you are in an area with favorable conditions for rust and don't have an active, aggressive spray program; viola, you have rust!

There are also sellers located in areas not conducive to rust who seldom see rust, but nevertheless are selling plants they have received with latent rust and depending on when and where the plant is resold, and its susceptibility to rust, the plant may suddenly become rusty.

Buying plants only from northern gardens is fine, if you are in northern gardens. But the northern garden might sell the very susceptible plants without knowing it.

At least there is an opportunity when buying from a southern garden that has rust, the seller knows if this is a susceptible plant or not. Hopefully, you will do your homework and try to ascertain how susceptible to rust the plant is you're considering purchasing.

That is my recommendation for those in southern areas.

If not, someone may sell you their problem plants - and that I feel, is being deceitful.

Ed

Betsy,

My RASPBERRY WINTER was also a real rust problem. The worst plant in the yard and now gone. Don't know where the rust came from but it really is a problem for those of us who cannot spray.

JoAnn

Here is a link that might be useful: RASPBERRY WINTER

Am I correct in assuming that the really "BIG" daylily growers in the Deep South ALL treat for rust and there is always the possibility that a plant (even the $200 ones) that I purchase from them may develop rust when the conditions are right for me in my zone 7b in NE MS??

This said, are any of us willing to say, yeap, I got rust in my garden? I bought plants last year from some Southern growers that sell on the LA and I got my first plant with rust in the late fall of 2006. I did all the advised things and this plant is fine this year.

Now, I bought about 50 plants this Spring and most came from Southern growers that sell on the LA. Guess what? I got about 10 plants that developed rust in the 100 to 108 degree days that we had for most of July and August. Rust is still showing it's ugly self in a few of my plants but nothing really bad. I do spray when I see it but now that I have it, I don't panic when I see some on a plant. I think I have just accepted that I live in a zone that rust is a problem.

I want to sell some of my seeds on the LA or Ebay. Is it wrong for me to do this knowing that I have rust in my garden?

What if I want to sell some of my plants that do not have rust?? I have probably 20 that do have rust and maybe 500 that don't, so does this mean that I can't sell any of them? The reason I haven't already listed some of my seeds is because it has been too darned hot to ship anything alive in my area, it would have cooked. It's finally cooling off and we got some much needed rain this last week. We're still about 20 inches below normal on rainfall and we broke every record known to man in NE MS for high temps this year.

Yes, I would always post in any auction, that I have rust and that I'm treating for it when necessary. Our winters are usually cold enough to get rid of rust, or atleast it did last year on the one plant that I had infected and I figure it will again this winter on the new ones with rust.

I hope this post doesn't sound crabby because that is not what I want it to sound. I just don't know what I should do about selling my daylilies or seeds and I need your help.

I can understand how the Northern growers feel that don't have rust because I thought I would have to kill all my plants last year when I saw rust for the first time. I was mad and upset but after reading about it, I think it is just something that Southern growers are going to have to deal with until someone finds a way to stop rust from growing.

I would appreciate all your coments, good or bad. Thanks Mona

After reading all these posts about the rust problems,I am getting concerned now,since it was up over 100 here,too,but is cooling down now.What do all of you spray with for a rust problem? I am new to daylilies.I have been growing roses for a while,but not dl's.Should I be spraying the DL's too,if so,with what?What should I be using to spray them with??

Jean

People who live in Zones 6 and cooler don't worry about rust because it doesn't winter over. It also doesn't kill the plant. I have never had it as far as I know, but in past years bought most of my daylilies from southern states.

I do believe that a seller should state that he has it if he does though.

mlwgardener, You can sell your seed. Rust spores have a very short shelf life outside of a host plant.

I don't think it is ethical to knowingly sell daylilies with rust without including that in the description, but since rust is an airborne disease everyone should presume plants from Florida & the Gulf Coast are probably infected ESPECIALLY FROM those sellers who state they are spraying...
mlwgardener/mona ~ I agree that selling your seeds would be safe for anyone.
Selling your infected daylilies with full disclosure is fine with me, too, since there are no doubt people who already have rust in their daylilies who who want them.
marea

I live in Texas and had beautiful daylilies beds. I only ordered from 2 daylily sources, Patrons Gardens, and Maryotts, gardens, never had a rust problem. Then in the spring I read on this form the name of a daylily provider in Florida, they mentioned this place was great and so was Maryotts. Since I knew how wonderful Maryotts was I assumed that this Florida source was just as good, so I order 5 plants from them, just to check them out, this was the biggest mistake I have ever made. Yes, I have daylily rust. My daylily beds are 175 miles from where I live at my second residence. I noticed that the leaves were discolored, but did the rust test and nothing came off the leaves, two weeks later I went back and rust was in full force. I cut back all the foliage, and burned it, sprayed the first time with bleach, then started spraying with a fungus spray, nothing worked, I started loosing plants. I could not wait until my vacation, so I could go down to work in my beds. Last week I went down and dug up all my dayliles, removed all the leaves down to the white core. soaked these roots in 10% bleach and 90% water for 6 hours, removed the top soil, and replanted the roots, with new soil. It took me 3 days, and if this doesn't work, I'm giving up. I received my fall order from Maryotts, that I placed in May, did not take them down, did not want to expose to the rust. I am going to wait and see what happens, I sure hope this works, and I can save my dayliles. I just read on the brugmansia forum that there's now rust on burgs. I wonder if it is the same fugus? Barbra,

The texas truth...only one way to kill rust...forcing the plant to go completely dormant. I assume several months in the winter would do nicely. But, we are talking about non dormants, and Texas. You can get rid of the infected plants I guess, but will you get rust next year or the next?

It is reasonable to say that all southern sellers have rust, no matter if they spray or not. You cannot buy without getting rust, and you cannot sell if you don't buy. If you only buy from the north you may do fine.

If you sell on the LA with rust, you are just like all of the southern sellers. Find me one that doesn't have rust. If you get sent plants with rust, you have rust, unless you can kill it or you junk the plants.

I would say that sooner or later a certain society might want to address important issues affecting daylilies. The excuses are losing their shine.

"I would say that sooner or later a certain society might want to address important issues affecting daylilies. The excuses are losing their shine" writes simplton.

As I am not affiliated with a certain society.. I wonder what excuses your referring too?

It is worse than "avoiding" the most important issues, it is complete denial that issues exist. For decades we could not even get any public confirmation that any problems exist. We have now evolved to the point where maybe problems exist, but "our hands are tied".

The "excuses" are the disclaimers...we have no power to control...we cannot take any action...there is no action needed...up to individuals not an organization. Any way to find middle ground where nothing will be done.

Responsibility is a concept that only applies to the past. We gave that up around the time easy money popped up. Back before greed was adopted as a national treasure. It is amazing that people think a society has no responsibility to its namesake.

Its getting to the point where it doesn't matter anyway. There is no need to have strong plants when the weak ones cannot supply the demand. It is up to nature to serve up a counter balance to the human influence, because no person will do it. So we have rust and rot, with the next one on its way.

Simpleton (good name for you, by the way), I'm not the pessimist you are. As in many cases, private industry has responded to daylily rot in a very positive way. Three weeks ago, a friend in the north FL daylily club told me about a nontoxic, inexpensive product that effectively fights rot in daylilies. He found out about through contacts at a golf course. I've used the product 3 times and rot in established and newly potted plants was stopped immediately. I'm president of the Central FL Daylily Society and four sets of members are using this product and will report back in 4-6 months with their experience.

Is there any chance of getting the name of this product?

I'm not endorsing it. As I mentioned, the club is testing it. To quote others, "a well known Florida hybridizer" has used it for 3 years. The product is called "Kphite Systemic Fungicide". Google will give you more details.

"as in many cases, private industry has responded to daylily rot in a very positive way"

That is a new one on me, as is the solution to rot. I am so sorry. Here I thought we had problems. The problems are solved? Well, I can do something else now. Thank you so much. It will be nice to find something better to do. Fifteen years of fighting the deceit of the business is over...not because we are doing the right thing, but because we have a new weapon.

So, the $1000 I spent on recent purchases which rotted before they ever started growing was due to my ignorance. Go figure...we had the problem solved all along!

Way to go guys!

When there is a problem and there is money to be made off of that problem, private industry is usually the one to create the solution. My problem here is that some of the big growers are using it, then they sell their plant stock to smaller hybridizers and enthusists. When the customers experience rot problems, the growers can shrug and deny any knowledge of the plant's rot problem.

From my own perspective, by using this product as necessary, I hope I can protect my collection despite the tendency of individual cultivars that to want to rot. I am just frustrated that this product has been on the market for 4 years and because I am a hobbyist, I have no way of knowing about it. Thank heavens for friends with contacts!!!

On another note, sarcasm is just a form of bad manners.

My uphill battle is never-ending. Good manners left maybe ten years ago. I admit it would be better had I the resiliency to consider manners. I just don't care about much these days. The toilet of life has started flushing and I'm holding onto the edge. The only thing I can do at this point is jump onto the only thing that floats...excuses.

"On another note, sarcasm is just a form of bad manners" writes beachlily.

Not meaning to critique or take any side here.. but sarcasm is hardly bad manners in many contexts. At times a fine way to slice up coumpound stupidity.. which life is full to the brim of. So many productive uses.. if done with style and humor, sarcasm often makes the irony of a situation crystal clear.. minus lots of words.

An analogy: Sarcasm is like dirt.. if it's on you it's usually bad. But under our flowers.. we want the best DIRT we can find.

This is an example of what Simpleton is talking about. I have four rotting as we speak and am in a tizzy of getting them dug, washed, trimmed, soaked in Physan 20, dusted with sulfur, set out to dry. Some plants I gave a soil drench, just because they were yellowing. I know there are several kinds of fungal rot and at least one kind of bacterial crown rot. I decided on Physan 20 from having read stuff from orchid sites, where reality is not hush, hush. I had it here and ready, and pulled out the plants early by sniffing the base of any yellowed or old leaves as I removed them. You absolutely cannot miss that smell. Only the first one flopped over--after I knew that smell I didn't need to wait that long. All four are from the same LA seller, never grew a bit, and rotted after the first rain in an unfertilized organic bed surrounded by healthy daylilies and other daylilies received and planted the same day, that are all fine. That's just ridiculous. I sent them an email to request advice and inquire about replacements if my attempts fail. No reply so far but they've not had much time so I can't say anything bad just yet. Even it they won't replace any, the bonuses I received were great and better than these ones that are sick -- so far.

It seems pretty darned straight forward, and while the society certainly is not responsible for policing sellers, I'm still annoyed that on the AHS site under FAQ 'What pests and diseases effect daylilies?' all the pests are mentioned but no diseases are addressed. Not leaf streak, not rust, and not crown rot. And why ever not???? Must each hobbiest reinvent the wheel for themselves? The problems are not really secret, as their own Daylily Dictionary gives excellent treatment of both terms -- if you know to look them up in the first place.

A society that states it's purpose is "educational and scientific"-- to support the betterment of the daylily and public interest, is shooting itself in the foot with this attitude of "don't mention it," and it seems to trickle down to many enthusiasts as a mandate. I understand they wouldn't want to advertise and highlight problems (although they have no problems with information such as "deer occasionally eat" daylily buds -- I raise my brows at the word 'occasionally', although from the prospective of a year in the life of one hungry deer it may seem occasionally.)

I found enough information to know the problems and pick a treatment. My point is, I [i]should[/i] have found it easily and authoritatively on the AHS website. I feel I found it despite the AHS. They have a responsiblity to the public trust that comes with their status and authoriy, and should not behave as a thinly veiled marketing tool retouching reality like the photoshop pictures on a hybridizers webshop. Otherwise, the whole site should have "advertisement" at the top of every page like I see on pseudo-articlistic ad pages in magazines. Trust is easier to keep than regain, and public interest will dose dive with loss of public trust. Where's the leadership? (Okay, jackarias IS great on this forum, I'll give the AHS that one.)
Instead I lurked about orchid forums, carniverous plant forums, and talked to rosarians. Perhaps the AHS thinks the [i]full truth[/i] might scare off a potential new hobbiest, but instead they aggravate actual hobbiests. I find that very short-sighted.

It's not these potential losses that bother me exactly --although obviously they are bothering me a lot, in their own way -- since I know 4 of 90 isn't much of a loss and I researched enough to expect it. Rather it's the way these issues are handled, hushed, and blown off repeatedly with feigned confusion, mis-information, and pleas of ignorance by first one stray AHS-er and then another. It's pervasive, this stonewall resistance to see tarnish on the shiny "perfect perennial." After a while, a few people seem positvely delusional and not just on this forum. "Focus on the positve" doesn't need to mean be blind to the negative. I can imagine the next post "Well, join the AHS and make it better!" -- like that's an attractive lure into the hobby-- but I don't know if that means I should take the red pill or the blue one.

I just wish everybody would relax, accept the obvious, and deal with the reality instead of straining so hard to shore up the status quo of "perfect perennial." Whoever adopted that slogan needs a thump on the head.

Now I may get hit harder in the next few days, and eat these words, but I think I know as much about everything as a newbie possibly could--and probably more than most--about many aspects of my new hobby. None of these issues put me off. I think my daylilies will be the joy of my life for many years to come even though (of course!) I hope my fungicides sit on the shelf until I worry about their expiration date, and these are the last four daylilies that ever rot on me.

Right now, I'm just embarrassed for the AHS. They love their daylilies and their members, but they don't seem to have faith in either one of them.

If you are waiting for someone from the leadership of the AHS to comment, you may wait a long time. I doubt that many of them even read anything here anymore. The forums here are just not taken very seriously by those in the know (jackarias, who has been most patient and excellent, notwithstanding). The previous management of this website cleared out most of the knowledgeable daylily people a couple of years ago and they can now mostly be found on Tinkers or the email daylily robin. In fact, rust and other pathogens are discussed quite often on Tinkers.

Kevin Waleck, president of the AHS, is one of the nicest, most genuine people that I know. If someone were to email him and ask him for his comments on this and other threads, I'm sure he would respond.

Several years ago when the rust problem reared it's ugly head and Gardenweb was just about the only forum of it's kind at the time, quite a few people tried to start discussions or give opinions about rust. However, there were several really nasty, very UGLY people on this daylily forum whose response to any rust discussion was "If you don't have rust, you need to just shut up." These people may or may not have been affiliated with the AHS, but they certainly weren't among the leadership. Real leaders do not behave that way.

Thankfully, those people are gone, but I can still feel the chill here on Gardenweb at times.

Simplton, I have to wonder why, after you have obviously repeatedly lost thousands of dollars worth of plants, that you continue to buy them? I love epiphyllums, but I don't grow them well and they don't like my environment. After spending several years of trying and hundreds of $$, I realized that I just wasn't going to be an epiphyllum grower.

Good question Ferengi. I will be selling my breeders and my seedlings in the Spring. I will keep some, but I am not sure now which ones. I am done hybridizing, and will make no more purchases.

I appreciate challenges, especially when there are problems in which there are victims. In Texas, we have the ability to cull our seedlings relentlessly. I started hybridizing a long time ago and I thought I had a good plan. I just couldn't commit enough to daylilies.

This last attempt was based on the idea that rust was controllable with the new fungicides. I didn't realize that it was all a joke.

I have always had a passion for daylilies, and I can't resist challenging large orgainizations. I took on the leadership of the USPS years ago when they displayed corruption and tried to behave like they are organized crime. I was forced into bankruptcy.

I consider both daylilies and the USPS episodes as victories. It is not the problem-solving that I was hoping for. That was nearly impossible. I just wanted to stand up for truth and do the right thing.

The control freaks at the USPS officially labeled me a terrorist threat because they could not compete with the integrity of my products. The dayliliy world labeled me a fool. The mail carriers and vehicle maintenance mechanics knew I was working for them, and they told me personally how much they appreciate my efforts. Daylily enthusiasts have done the same. The people at the bottom, out in the field, are the ones with integrity. They put up with the bad decisions of our bureaucratic leaders.

Petalpatsy an excellent post. Right on point and focused on the meat of the issue. Well done.
____________________________________________________________

"The previous management of this website cleared out most of the knowledgeable daylily people a couple of years ago and they can now mostly be found on Tinkers or the email daylily robin" writes FerengiGold.

Great handle.. I just got FG this spring.. impressive performance so far.

On this count I wanted to submit this: from what I read the last week or so this group is completely real and deep in the knowledge/practical experience side. Looks to me as a gathering place for all of us sick and tired of the delunsional status quo per our daylily. I see several names here of long time daylily people.. this forum looks well stocked to me. Very encouraging to read this real world posting.

cbraider on LA just sent me rust. Be warned. I sent them an email yesterday, so far no response. I recieved/planted (thankfully away from the rest of the collection) on 10/17 - on 10/23 I found rust on the two they sent.