black spanish and black jack same fig?

17 years ago

hi friends,

i was wondering if black spanish and black jack are

the same fig. is anyone growing either variety in

the northeast. also how big are the hardy chicago figs?

i'm looking for at least a medium size black fig.

i have a tree sold to me as a brown turkey but

they are the smallest thin skinned figs i ever saw

but they are sweet. they rot fast and ants seem to

take over. my fellow italians are telling me they

are wild figs. i need a good main crop variety to

grow in the ground just hope hardy chicago are

not tiny and pathetic. any advice?

marcantonio

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Comments (6)

pitangadiego
17 years ago
I have both. In my opinion they are similar, and maybe the same. In my opinion, they are both very similar to Brown Turkey, very similar to Walker and Blue Giant as well. If you are a BT fan, you will like them. If not, skip them.
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tcstoehr
17 years ago
According to this page, they are the same.

http://www.nafex.org/figs.htm
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fignut
17 years ago
Small, thin skinned, sweet figs - sounds like Celeste. Brought to mind an article by A.J. Bullard in the Southern Fruit Fellowship newsletter (Issue #5 1989):
"It so happens that the two fig varieties most commonly grown east of the Mississippi are the two most confused...It seems Brown Turkey got the inside track with figs early on and became the Frigadere of refrigerators so to speak. Nurseries mislabeled Celeste as Brown Turkey - some by honest ignorance and some to sell Brown Turkey figs which customers called for. Some major nurseries didn't know the difference."
"Both varieties are adapted to the Southeast so why does it make any difference?"
"First as my fig Guru Paul Starnes says, don't ask a fig owner what variety he has because he doesn't know but calls it Brown Turkey or Celeste (Sugar) - usually having the varieties reversed."
...."Celeste is the most common fig grown in the Southeast and is somewhat more cold hardy than Brown Turkey....Celeste trees stood that had been hurt very little in over 40 years enduring at least one zero and one 1 degree F ...without much kill-back if any....The owner said the Celeste had never been killed back in its 40+ years but the Brown Turkey, 'got killed back to the ground every few years'. Same exposure, soil type, climate, etc...."
"Brown Turkey will bear fruit the first season after being 'leveled' on sucker growth while Celeste won't. Brown Turkey also will produce a Breba crop if the terminals aren't killed back much in addition to a main crop. Celeste almost never (Dave Ulmer) has brebas to mature....The Turkey brebas are larger than the main crop figs and much larger than Celeste. Turkey brebas are often 'lop sided' but to my taste about like the main crop. Celeste figs are more symmetrical, smaller and sweeter than Turkey."
"One ID I find useful with developing furit is that the scales around the eye of half grown and over Turkey figs are pink or red while those of comparably sized Celeste figs are green. The eye of mature Turkey figs is somewhat open while Celeste is closed and is therefore a better keeper - resisting souring better. Celeste seems to have a longer stem than Turkey but the skin color isn't a whole lot different."
As to leaf shape both are classified as 'grape' leaf .....but a common basic difference exists between the most typical leaf type of Celeste compared with Brown Turkey. Sometimes to see this difference more clearly one must examine sucker growth or new growth resulting from heading back old limbs. Celeste leaves are slightly broader and tend to have more serrations. Turkey leaves are slightly more elongated and tend to have few serrations per lobe.".......
"I find Celeste the M.V.P. of figs and an excellent stock to graft less cold hardy varieties onto to make them hardier."
Marcantonio, Does Celeste sound like your tiny and pathetic fig? Ripening early September?
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User
17 years ago
Hi Marcantonio:I had a different experience with Celeste here in New Jersey.I bought three cultivars and they were not small but Medium to Large.
I found out later after growing them for about four years that they were inferior wild figs with large fruits little taste,dropping fruits and not adapted to the cold weather of new Jersey.
In this time my friend George in North Jersey has a Celeste with small fruits of excellent taste and they almost get ripe on the tree if not Harvested.
I also have grown and discarded Black Spanish and,Black Jack for the reason:
They produced very large showy fruits that when ripe were tasteless,no sugar or flavor,because of lack of adeqvate heat in NJ,climate.
Also they need to be caprified to be in their,prime.
At present time i have new Black Jack cuttings to make sure i had the right cultivar before,and will see results next sommer.
Hope this will help
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espo8
17 years ago
herman, I'm assuming that the celeste that george has in north jersey with the small fruits of excellent taste is the real celeste.Because I think this tree comes from Malta and I think george is from there. What do you think?

espo
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User
17 years ago
No ,Espo:Actually,George bought it from a Nursery about sixteen years ago,and he do not remember the name of the place.
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