Believe me Nell DH and I are first in line when the flu shots are being given out, now that the kids are soon back to school the H1N1 will probably rear it's ugly head again.
We keep a bottle of Purell on the kitchen counter, one in the car, and I have a small one in my purse. Even when I know I shouldn't it's amazing how many times I find I'm touching my face.
How many of us think when we're pushing the grocery cart around how many germs are or could be on the handle, door knobs, the list goes on.
These flu strains are just getting nastier and nastier, so frequent hand washing is the no.1 thing to do to help protect yourself.

Also people with immune system problems like me should inquire about having another pneumonia shot 5 years down the road from their first, I'm due for mine.

Good advice Nell, lets hope we all survive what could be a very bad flu season.

Annette

Thanks for the reminder, Nell. We always make sure to get one every fall too, and keep hand wipes in our vehicles all year around to clean those store cooties off our hands.

About the cell wall ... that's a bacteria thing, right, not a virus? Or am I mis-remembering my biology?

ThinMan

Our flu shots will not be available here until October, with the H1N1 available in November.

I did get a shingles vaccination yesterday, and I am getting a pneumonia shot tomorrow. I am getting so old that it takes a bit of planning to keep myself going. LOL

Janie

I'm scheduling my appointment for next week, Nell, thanks for the reminder. And the biology refresher ;)

MeMo

Thanks for looking out for us, Nell!

I work in health care, so I will certainly be getting those shots.
Bonus is that I'll be getting paid while they "stick" me.

Patti

Thanks for the reminder, Nell. I'm not in one of the risk groups identified here, so I assume I won't be taking the shot. But this could change quickly. Portugal has one of the highest levels of A flu in Europe (we have loads of tourists and this also helps to disseminate the virus), so our Health Ministry is keeping on top of things and their strategy is being fine tuned as needed. Classes won't start before mid September here, and our traditional flu season is usually later in the year, so we are keeping our fingers crossed this won't become a major pain.

One thing that has been puzzling me - maybe Nell or someone else can answer - is why are pregnant women advised to take the vaccine? I would assume any kind of vaccine is a no-no during pregnancy, why is this case different? Anyone knows? Isn't the vaccine going to affect the baby?

Eduarda

I didn't know the answer to the question about pregnant women, so I did some looking. One argument for the flu shot is that fever during flu has bad effects for the baby. One argument against is that the preservative is a mercury derivative. Further careful research (University Medical centers, CDC and National Institutes of Health sites and discussion with an obstretrician) is needed to make these decisions. Scary, isn't it?

It's very scary. I would say that the risk of pregnancy fever is significantly less than injecting mercury into a pregnant body, wouldn't you say? At least my first impression would be. Maybe there are other medical reasons behind. From experience of working in the medical area for several years, especially with handicapped children, I personally would be extremely reluctant to take any sort of vaccine during pregnancy.

Let's hope we can all pass this flu pandemic with flying colors.

Eduarda

Very timely topic. I am taking medical Office Admin., and they still tell us that liquid soap and warm water are your best bet. Alcohol gel is #2. Bleach is still the best bactericide. Cough or sneeze into your elbow. Remove all rings when you wash your hands (put them in your pocket, cause you might forget them!) CDC gives these washing instructions:

When washing hands with soap and water:
* Wet your hands with clean running water and apply soap. Use warm water if it is available.
* Rub hands together to make a lather and scrub all surfaces.
* Continue rubbing hands for 20 seconds. Need a timer? Imagine singing 'Happy Birthday' twice through to a friend!
* Rinse hands well under running water
* Dry your hands using a paper towel or air dryer. If possible, use your paper towel to turn off the faucet.

These are the standards required at school. When around children, remove rings and jewellery - they harbour all kinds of nasties. As to flu shot or no - it is best to say yes, especially if you will be around children or seniors, or anyone with a compromised immune system. Here, almost everyone who has died had a compromised immune system, and you just don't know when you may come in contact with such an individual.

I attached a letter to the editor from the Ottawa paper, from the Head of division of infectious diseases, The Ottawa Hospital. It really has a lot on info.

Nell, thanks for starting this.

Nancy.

Here is a link that might be useful: Wash your Hands

I did get my pneumonia shot, and I am now trying to decide if I want to pay the extra money to get a flu shot from my private doctor, or wait for the Health Department to start giving them next month. The nurse did tell me that doctors in the area are giving them now. This is someone (me) who smoked for 40 years, (2 packs a day), and who also has asthma. Oh, yes, I quit smoking almost 12 years ago, so my doctor advises me that my chances for getting emphysema etc. are the same now as for anybody else.

Also, I am not destitute, I just try to save a little when I can.

Advice, please?

Janie

Our flu shots are not available until the end of Oct. beginning of Nov. We have been advised to not get them too soon as our flu season can run into May around here. I don't know when our H1N1 vaccine will be available, the same time as our flu shots, maybe.

A little cafe we frequent in our local grocery store does have one of those hand washing stations, also London Drugs has made hand gel available to their customers by placing it at the entrance to their store.

You can never be too careful, I've had the bad flu 3 times in my life, having a compromised immune system it takes me months to get over them. I even wipe door knobs and taps with alcohol wipes during flu season, over kill, I don't think so.

Annette

I don't think so either, Annette.

I was in WalMart with a 'friend' awhile back. I went into the ladie's room and came out with wet hands. There was a paper towel dispenser outside, so I wasn't going to drip dry. My friend asked why I didn't dry my hands inside, and I said...

"If I came out wet, I could go out with the lady who exited right in front of me, and not have to touch the door." That makes perfect sense to me...I hate touching anything in a public restroom, and will avoid them unless it is just not possible to do so. And I get positively ill when I see someone leave the facility without washing their hands. How nasty can you get?

My 'friend' said....."So, do you mean to say that you wash your hands EVERY TIME YOU GO TO THE BATHROOM?" This is a casual, former friend.

Yikes! and YUK!

Janie

Good reminder.

We have to wait until October. I always get one because I have mitral valve prolapse w/regurgitation (blood back flows due to a leaky valve in the heart) and have to be very careful not to get viruses or infections. People with mvp used to have to take antibiotics just for teeth cleaning! That changed in the last year. Anyway, the one year that we had a flu shot shortage and couldn't get a shot, I got sick and it lasted 5 months because it affected my heart. So, i ALWAYS get one.

Stay well!

Cameron

Okay, anybody else here who will not accept a flu shot of any description?

I won't. Just asking if anyone else is of like mind.

Zigzag - I'm curious - why not?

Nancy.

I'm a teacher and I ALWAYS get my flu shot since getting sick one year and having the cough for what seemed like months!! Not sure yet when the H1N1 will be available here, but will get that, too. Always wash my hands a lot, too! Cynthia

I believe everyone should do what works for them. So PLEASE do not take my post wrong.....but I also feel a need to share with everyone I can when this topic comes up...

My father DIED because of the flu shot....he contracted Gillian Barrie (sp?) within a few weeks of the shot. He spent two years in intense pain and walked with a walker. He was almost a complete invalid at age 58....In perfect health prior to the shot....after battling Gillian for two years...he found himself left with Lymphoma. He died from this. He went to a well respected research hospital and they told him both Gillian and Lymphoma are anti immune disorders...and both have been found to follow each other in the exacty order after a flu shot in the same manner that he got them. Basically as we understand it, one overwhelms the immune system and leaves the gates open behind it for the other to enter. Because your immune system is so compromised it takes over. It is not as uncommon as you might think.. my dad died from it......UNLESS a family member of mine was a HIGH HIGH risk for the flu...I would NOT get this or any other flu shot. I think you have to weigh your risks...my dad was the one in a million yes...but you know what..a close friends 21 year old son had the flu shot and ALSO contracted Gillian within weeks......thats two in a million...thats too much for me....I watched them suffer and I will take my chances...also I recently found this info....

Thimerosal may be present in some doses of the new H1N1 (Swine Flu) vaccine. Experts feel that as the fall approaches, parents nationwide will become increasingly alarmed, divided and outspoken over the ingredient, which some claim is linked to autism

It is my understanding that in 2002 0r 2003 thimerosal was removed from Childrens vaccines because of the concerns over its health related issues...I can not for the life of me think of a reason why you would remove it from a childs vaccine and then add it to another a few years later......

My family and my extended family ops out of the flu shot for all of these reasons....for those of you who don't...I wish the best for you all.....I am glad we can all make the choices best for us.....

Thanks for listening to my rambling....I hope I have not offended any of you with my choices and my voice against it, if I have I am sincerely sorry.

Keesha - no harm, no foul. I couldn't imagine why one would opt out, though I have a friend who always gets quite sick from the flu shot, and she no longer takes it. It is something to do with the growing medium for the serum. Thimerosal is apparently another growing medium? Not sure. But if your Dad was allergic, odds might be good that you and members of your family will be as well. Guillain-Barre is actually is actually 1 or 2 per 100,000, so not insignificant, though Mayo says in most cases it can be 'cured'.
For me, I get the shot, and am glad of it. Touch wood, as I used to get seriously ill with the flu, and it would hang on forever.

Here is a link that might be useful: Mayo clinic

I have been mulling over the idea of not getting the swine flu shot, just because of the chance of getting Guillain-Barre. My sister and a good friend (who is also a RN) both told me about it. I have taken the flu shot for several years, but this does give me pause.

Janie

Not to bore you to tears with numbers, but here is some data:
Today, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, as many as 36,000 people in the United States die each year of complications of influenza and more than 200,000 are hospitalized.
Talk to your Dr. about it. There is still so much the medical profession is learning, every day. The key for everything seems to be how healthy you are going in to it. Good luck with your decision.

Nancy.

Here is a link that might be useful: Prevention

Nancy, I am sorry that you can not understand why anyone, would opt out of the flu shot. All I can do is tell my families story and let each person make the choice best for them. Sometimes that includes the flu shot being the best choice, and sometimes it does not.

It is ironic the link you included to Gillian is the very facility that diagnosed my father and first dared to breathe those ugly words...flu shot connection.. Gillian is much more severe that a paragraph on the net. It is a life changing illness..The last I looked it up, on average it takes a person TWO ugly years to be "cured" of gillian. And in other cases, such as my fathers, worse things occur. I am not making this up, this is real and ugly and once you begin to talk about it, many people start sharing similar stories....we all choose to believe what we want, and what effect our life. It sounds like for YOU personally, getting the shot is the best choice, the scales are balanced differently than they are for those of us who are healthy and are just considering it because we are "AFRAID" of the flu...

ZIGAG, care to share why you wont get the shot? I would love to hear it. I feel like I am standing here alone in my belief...

Another note..did u know in MOST cases you sign a release when getting the flu shot that says you understand Gillian is a risk. It is in tiny fine print on a great many flu shots.

Also, it makes me wonder why an ingredient taken out of a childs vaccine over its risks, would be added back in to the flu vaccine? Any risk it could play an ugly part, is too much for me....

By the way, I am afraid of this new flu..I work at a school and feel I am at high risk....I am doing what I can to stay protected.....short of getting the shot...I draw the line there and will take my chances...

Cameron and anyone else with risk factors..I salute your choice to get the shot..for you, it is a must. I respect that...I hope none of us get the flu..tho I don't think it is going to be so easy...

I heard recently a similar strain of this flu went around in 1957..if you were born prior to that, You MAY HAVE a natural immunity to it......fact or fiction, any idea?

it is spelled Guillain-Barré if your trying to search it by the way..

You present a very thought-provoking case against flu shots, Keesha. Anything that we take into our bodies has both good and bad side effects. We weigh those side effects according to our own experiences to decide whether what is offered is worth the risks, large and small.

A person who is allergic to eggs would naturally refuse the shot, as would anyone who believes the mercury deriviative used as preservative is more harmful than a case of the flu. The old argument about the shot causing the flu is no longer valid since an inactivated virus is used rather than the live virus of the 1960's when my husband always got a mild case of flu along with the shot that he took anyway.

I never believed that I 'needed' a flu shot until 1991 when I had flu for the first time ever. I promised that if I were allowed to live to get back home to Georgia, I would always take a flu shot.

About the second year I took my flu shot, everybody in the healthcare agency where I worked got the flu except for one secretary and me; we were the only two who had taken the flu shot. The following year the hospital under whose umbrella our agency worked gave every employee who took a flu shot, $10 and a bottle of vitamin C at the Company picnic.

We should all be informed consumers. When researching, we should decide whether the resources we are reading have valid research backing their claims. Weigh relative risks against proof of specific causes. Talking to our own physician is a good first step.

I respect your right to refuse a flu shot for whatever reason. Stay well. If you get the flu, stay home and try not to pass it on to others.

Keesha - you may need to re read my posts.

Nancy.

As I said before I've had these bad flues but had them before flu shots were available. Having a compromised immune system due to Lupus they hit me really hard, it took months, at least 6 to get over them completely. Thank goodness I'm not allergic to eggs, or I'd really be up the creek.
There is always THAT chance with any medication you take something can go wrong but for me I'm willing to take that chance, even so these shots don't give me the same protection as someone who's immune system is working for them and not against them like mine does.
Yes some people shouldn't have them if there is a history in their family where there has been problems but this is something that each person has to decide for themselves, me I remember what I went through and I'm dang well going to do everything I can to prevent it from ever happening again.

Annette

I got mine today @ W**gr**ns for $24.99..

They will also be doing H1N1 The pharmacist suggested I get that also, as it will have mutated from what we had in June.

What ever we had in June was horrible. Diane described our symptoms to her cardiologist and he told her we most likely had H1N1 flu. I don't think either of us could live through that again.

FIrst an apology to keesha - I truly didn't mean to drop a bomb and then disappear. No excuse, but I had a bit of a melt-down this week. Over now.

Keesha, thank you for your personal insight, and my deepest condolences to you and your family on the loss of your Dad. I've read horrifying accounts of GB online, but never from a 'real person' - and you are a real person.

My refusal to get a flu shot (any flu shot) is pretty straight forward and not particularly documented by much of anything ..... I simply do not have confidence in the powers that be these days and their 'way' of fixing things. Much of my professional career has been in private practice surgical offices, crowned with a half decade in a start-up biotech venture where I got an insider look at FDA, CDC, HMS, BIH, AMA, NEJM and a bunch of other medical alphabet-soup luminaries and what I saw left me cold.

I also come from strong, peasant stock so have enjoyed a strong constitution w/no illnesses, save a head cold or two, forever. Every time I've left a job, it has been with a nice check for unused 'sick time'.

Well, until I was diagnosed w/metastatic cancer a while back - figured it was my payback for so many decades of good health. I dealt with that, kicking and screaming the whole way - so far, so good, we'll see what the future brings.

Seeing a so-called Newscast extending flu fear factor while collecting gazillions of dollars from pharma companies as their advertising support strikes me a being a big, really big, conflict of interest. History is peppered with epidemic/pandemic fears; some thinned 'the herd', some just sputtered out - so much hype. There has always been a hidden agenda - these days, it's all about the money.

I'm not stupid, tho I cannot cite studies and statistics to confirm or debunk the purported 'experts'. I'm just a pretty ordinary person who isn't willing to line up and take the 'shot' as told, given what I've seen. And reports of certain states that are considering 'mandating - requiring' residents to take the shot mortify me. What about medical contraindications, what about religious objections? This mass immunization threat is soooo not possible or right - at least in the America where I grew up.

In my case, my pathetically limited lifestyle leaves me at lower risk. I will be more diligent (hand wipes in the car console for post supermarket trips) 'doin my part. The little guys and college age folks don't usually cross my path, but if they do, I won't shun them.

Sorry for such a long post - thanks for reading if you've gotten this far .... btw, I raw feed my dog - she's a svelt 10' beagle - and don't over-vaccinate her either - so there! (Fair to say that much of my vaccine info and aversion comes from my studies on canine vaccines which are closely aligned w/human vaccines). I'm just sayin' ..............

hmm...if you are my age, we did grow up in an America with mass immunizations-remember polio? We were all immunized in the mid-fifties and then again in 1963 or so. That later vaccine was given to everyone in our area at the local schools. People filled the gyms and waited in line. Sometimes, it can be a good thing.

I agree..sometimes it can...and then sometimes it is not...I personally had a it is not kind of experience...that alters just how good I personally feel about it. I

Thats why it is good we can decide for ourselves...

Thanks zig for your input. I was feeling lonely :)

Keesha, not meaning to be critical of your decision at all! Just get tired of hearing 'facts' thrown around with the implication that the government is the enemy.

Cyn, I am sorry for tiring you with this...and to those in support of this issue I am sorry I pushed my views onto you.

I did not begin this post myself because I wanted to push my views on you. But when I saw the post, I believed it was a open invite to ALL views, even when they do not match the popular.

This is a VERY emotional issue for me. My dad died a slow and painful death as a direct result of the flu shot. He was not medically frail, he was not in ANY of the risk groups. He did not have ANY allergies or sensitivities. He was a normal healthy mid fifties kind of man. Enjoying life, working hard to reach his dreams and loving life. He thought he was making a good choice too in taking the shot to stay healthy...he did not know it would end his life at the time.

If I am wrong to share his story or to "push" his story on others, I am sorry I offended you. I am not sorry tho to share his story, even if it is ugly and against popular choice. My opinion on this issue is as important as yours. IF JUST ONE person remembers this story some day and gets to a dr at the first hint of a trouble after the shot then it was worth it to me. I am sorry that is upset the apple cart to do so tho. It saddens me that it is like that....

For the record, I am not ANTI goverment....never have been, never will be. I AM EXTREMELY proud we CAN choose this shot and we can speak our objections...
For the most part, The facts I offered you were my own story....real life....not statistics or studies. I did not invent this story, I lived it.

ZIG was the ONLY person in all these threads that even said, I Am sorry for your loss, I understand it,but here is my view in support or against.........but there were many posts that just talked about their support of the shot instead without even a note or mention of my loss expressed...that makes me sad.....really sad.

I wont say anything else on this subject, I learned a good lesson here.

I hope with ALL of my heart none of you or any of your friends or loved ones ever face this.....

Keesha, I for one am glad you brought up what could happen, although I will be having my flu shot I am now aware of what could happen if things go wrong, we can get so complacent about such things.
Losing a loved one to something like this is so... well I don't have the words. There is nothing that compares to the pain suffered when something like this happens, although different circumstances this has happened in our family too. I'm sending a great big hug your way and I will head to my doctor if I have ANY adverse effects to my flu shot.
Thanks for the heads up.

Annette

Keesha, wasn't your posts at all that I was responding to. If you read the post directly above mine, you will notice the references to mass immunizations. Your posts neither upset nor offended me. I was so sad to read of your experiences. I am sorry you thought I was responding to you-didn't intend that at all and thought I made it clear , but I guess I didn't. You were sharing your personal story and those are definitely important to hear for all of us.
I am so sorry that I didn't make myself clear and that I upset you. Never meant to do that at all!!!

Cynthia

I'm feeling a little responsible for this contentious turn of posts here. And while I meant to support keesha, I think I did her wrong. I apologize.

We're all reading a lot of 'stuff' from many sources and trying to process said info. When I mentioned mandatory 'mass immunizations', I was referring to what I'd read of just that - folks being forced take the needle mandatory "flu" immunizations. It had been reported, during this whole fray, that such was in play in a couple of states. Yea for the media ......well, that died down.

Cynthia's comparison to the polio epidemic (well within my lifetime) rang very hollow to me as any sort of a comparable 'mandated, requirement'. I do remember that fear and the immunizations and that was very real. I do not recall any requirement of immunization. But that was then.... and we trusted and complied. And it worked. Mostly because we trusted and then, the science was good.

Google 'polio epidemic' and look at the timeline and the consequences (iron lungs, paralysis) and the decades of lab work to come up w/the Salk vaccine. It is just not comparable to the 'sniffly, sneezy, coughy, can't sleep' flu. Not a good comparison. But, pharma companies don't drop a stitch - vaccine/cures on the fly are on their finanical horizon.

Sidenote: I worked for/with a post-polio person who adopted a sport to rebuild polio weakened limbs and went on to become an Oympic Gold Medalist. I learned a lot and have huge respect for that struggle and achievement.

Just have trouble assigning the same respect and trust to curing today's "disease of the week". These days, it's all about the money and keeping the sheeple in orderly lines of compliance.

To reiterate, I totally respect Keesha's stand and appreciate her sharing her family tragedy with us. I know she shared this totally in the spirit of warning for all. It won't always happen, but it might- her message.

I'm taking it seriously ..... y'all can do whatever.

This is a great discussion and we all need to be alert to the many factors of an issue like this. So very sorry to hear about your father's suffering, Keesha. I worked with a man who had GB, not sure of the cause, but the results of his illness were difficult to even witness. I did get the seasonal flu shot 3 days ago and cannot believe how painful my arm still is! I don't remember this from previous flu shots. It hurts even into my shoulder and neck. I hope this means it is going to be a very strong protection!! Anyone else who got the shot notice more pain than from previous vaccinations?

Debby

Dh gets it every year. He works on offshore oil rigs where all it takes is one person getting sick to bring down a whole crew. Don't know if he plans on getting the H1N1 when it's available, but I sort of doubt it. Our age group supposedly has a degree of immunity.