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viuno

Why can't I grow a Dawn Redwood?

viuno
16 years ago

Hello to all.

I haven't posted in a while but I lurk here all the time. There's always something interesting to read and some great advice. I hope someone can help me with my problem.

After reading about these trees some ten years ago I finally had the chance to see some growing at the botanical garden in ST. Louis and it was love at first site. So after scouring the nooks and crannies of every garden center I found one and immediately planted it in my yard. It was only about 4' when it was planted but jumped a couple of feet the first year. I knew it was destined for greatness.

Gradually over the next several years it went into decline. Each year progressively less foliage. People were asking me "what's that?" with a painful look on their face.

I tried giving it more water, it would struggle to produce maybe 2 more needles. I tried giving it less, it dropped needles. I fed it, it did nothing.


I decided it was one of two things, girdled roots or too much wind. I had planted 5 loblolly pines from small containers years before and when one died I dug it up to see one root had encased several others to make a gnarled mess so I figured that was a possibility with the redwood as well. Since I had given the redwood the prime location in my yard to protect it from the wind there was nothing left to try.

By this time it looked like a 9' stick with hairy arms. So after much deliberation, I had mercy on it and cut it down. I proceeded to dig up the roots to find the culprit that had choked my dream to death, but no, the roots looked great.... I had murdered it.

I promised I wouldn't subject a living thing to that kind of torture again.

However, now spring is just around the corner and I'm seeing all these pictures of beautiful specimens and new varieties and I don't know if I can stop myself?

Should I try again or save the space for something else? If I did try again, what should I do differently?

I have never had to admit defeat to a tree before and I've been planting them for 30 years but I'm not getting any younger and I still have no definitive answer to what went wrong. What would YOU DO?

Thanks in advance.

Comments (19)

  • kingn8
    16 years ago

    Never ever give up on something after the first try, especially not a dawn redwood!
    Get another, and I would try watering it more, it's pretty hard to overwater these things.

    First questions that come to mind is what kind of soil are you working with, and how high do your summer temperatures get? Could be as simple as too much heat and not enough water. Could also be, for the sake of calling it nothing better; a bad tree to begin with.

    Try, and try again.

    Nate

  • conifers
    16 years ago

    Give it as much sun as possible. Dig a wide hole for it to start off on. Water it once a week for the first year and then when you feel like it therafter and you should be in business.

    Dax

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  • viuno
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    I've been away from the house this weekend and was pleasantly suprised to see someone had already touched base. Thank you.

    Nate and Dax, I apologize for not giving more local info in the first post. I live in central arkansas and our summers are almost unbearable. The soil is a heavy clay. I had prepared a 6' transition area when I planted the tree and now that you both mentioned that I'm wondering if it just ran out of good dirt. That would explain why it did really well the first year and slowly declined afterward.

    Nate, I believe you are right about not giving up after just on shot. I normally don't do that, but we had no trees at all when we built this house 11 years ago. Now in spite of the 100 degree+ temperatures we see in the summer, I'm proud to say I have 14 trees and too many shrubs that can stand on their own through most of it. So you can see that's a lot of water until they all got established.
    And there is my greatest concern, does this tree just need more water than I can give it? I guess there is only one way to know for sure. I'll try again.
    I have noticed a low spot in the corner of the backyard where water seems to sit longer than anywhere else, there's plenty of sun and I'll keep my expectations low this time.
    Now and then I just need a push, Thanks again to both of you. I am never disappointed when I post in this forum.
    Vi

  • treelover3
    16 years ago

    Hi Vi,
    Please don't amend the soil when planting. Anything you plant needs to grow in the native soil sooner or later - and sooner is better.

    In heavy clay soil you end up making a bathtub-like area when you amend the soil and that does more damage than anything. Also, to plant in heavy clay soil you can leave up to half of the root ball above the soil level and then mulch really well. It will also help to start with a smaller tree since the root ball is not as large. Metasequoia is a VERY fast growing tree and there is no need to start with a large plant.

    I am successfully growing Metasequoia here in Minneapolis, MN, USDA zone 4a, and while our summers are not as hot as yours we do get hot here in the summer with lots of humidity - and our winters can be brutal too.
    Good luck and don't give up, this is a great tree.
    Mike

  • viuno
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Hi Mike, thanks for responding.

    I won't amend the soil this time, but was planning on taking out all the grass and tilling up the area to connect another planting area with this spot to make a large bed. And I will remember to raise the tree up a bit. DH can get me all the mulch I need for free so that should get us started off right anyway.

    As far as starting small, that sounds like an excellent idea too, but just finding one locally will be a challenge. I've only seen one or two since I planted that one so I may have to resort to ordering outside my area. I'll call around and be sure to ask what size they have.

    If this tree can handle Minnesota winters and Arkansas summers, that's a pretty impressive resume for a conifer.
    Happy growing and thanks again.

    Vi

  • xyus_quebec
    16 years ago

    Treelover3, was your metasequoia buy in nursery or grown from seeds? It's quite impressive that you are having success in zone 4a. Does your metasequoia have suffered from major freezing since you plant it? Because here, they don't performed well am i am in zone 5b. But they are majorly produced from cutting not from seeds, i am sure that the specimen they cut from isn't well adapted. The top of the tree dies or the specimen are very limited in height. The tallest are the Montreal's botanical garden and are limited to 10m.

  • ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
    16 years ago

    i swear... victory garden has done more harm than good.. telling us to hyper amend all of our soils ...

    you said: was planning on taking out all the grass and tilling up the area to connect another planting area with this spot to make a large bed.

    i used to do all that.. lots of great exercise ... but.. i have learned over the years.. trees/conifers/shrubs ... DONT CARE ...

    round up grass ... lay on 3 to 5 inches of mulch ... walk away ... by the second year... the soil underneath is like playdough ... but i NEVER started with clay ....

    dig hole... loosen soil.. remove plant from pot.. cut or unfurl any crazy circling roots ... insert in ground.. refill half way.. water well.. refill the remainder.. and water again ... add mulch.. water again .. when your index finger indicates hot or dry at the second knuckle ... this could be weeks or months later .... they do not need a drink everyday ...

    there is a very good chance.. that you are killing this plant with too muck love ... they are one of the oldest trees on the face of the planet ... and can do very well with just a bit of water during transplant ... but for zone pushing .....

    trees just don't need all that foo foo stuff ... its a waste of money.. imho ...

    now.. if you are going for record setting maters ... well then its victory garden time ...

    good luck

    ken

  • treelover3
    16 years ago

    xyus_Quebec,
    My tree was seed-grown. I purchased the tree at the MN State Fair for $5.00 in 1995, '96 or '97 (this is one of the few trees that I don't have an exact purchase or planting date). My tree was damaged one year when we had an early winter, but not very badly. Metasequoia needs a long, warm fall to mature its wood for the year.

    I have started many trees from my tree since it has done so well here in Mpls. My Metasequoia is in THE most exposed site in my yard.
    Mike

  • viuno
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Hi Ken, thanks for your input.
    I agree, trees don't require that much additional work but I plan on planting other things in this area besides just the tree and my yard was has been heavily compacted over the years (it used to be a hayfield).

    You said " round up grass ... lay on 3 to 5 inches of mulch ... walk away ... by the second year... the soil underneath is like playdough ... but i NEVER started with clay ...."
    I would venture to guess you never started with common bermuda grass either. 3-5 inches of mulch will just make this stuff a happy home. Round-Up might get it eventually but bermuda must be actively growing in order to kill it with Round-Up, for my area that would put it around mid May to spray the first time. It will require at the very least spraying twice maybe more. Now we're into June or possible July for a third spray. Personally, I think that is a waste of money and time.
    I try to avoid using chemicals when possible and in this case I'd prefer just to clean the bed out and be done with it.

    Vi

  • Rick_Ingersoll
    12 years ago

    Well, Hello everyone, I am in Wasilla Alaska, I just received my 25 Dawn Redwoods 1 ft trees and will see how well they grow in Alaska! I got interested in Dawn Redwoods after reading about their 're-discovery' in China and reading about Dawn Redwood fossils in Sutton Alaska. So, I am planting them today and tomorrow. Wish me luck!

    Rick

    Here is a link that might be useful: Ingersoll Genealogy

  • bjb817
    7 years ago

    So how did they do in AK?

  • davidrt28 (zone 7)
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    If they haven't been active since 2011 they are unlikely to answer now. (you know you can click on their names to see recent posts, right?)

  • PRO
    Ed York & Sons Handyman and Remodeling
    7 years ago

    They go dormant in winter. I thought I killed my baby 8 incher last year. I just left him alone in the greenhouse and in the spring of last year he started growing little green buds. He is now 2 feet tall. He is still confused on seasons though. He doesnt like it too hot. He loses his leaves if it's too hot. I moved him outside the greenhouse 2 weeks ago because his leaves were starting to turn brown. I think it was too hot in the greenhouse.. He now has new little green sprouts on his stems so he will be ok.


  • Toronado3800 Zone 6 St Louis
    7 years ago

    In pots they do all kinds of strange things. In the ground I can't say even my Ogon has burned, it and my species trees are thrilled as long as it rains enough

  • User
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    You definitely have to watch them if they are growing in pots. I just replaced three that I lost due to being negligent regarding watering. (Two other DR's re-foliated after I watered more heavily. None of the Bald Cypresses in pots suffered.) Especially, those black plastic pots get HOT fast in the sun. The DR I have in the ground is gooding pretty good. Once established they can take some some heat and moderate drought, but compared to BC, DR seems to prefer a bit of shading from the hottest sun; whereas BC really needs full sun. Been droughty here in NJ but not as bad as further north where it is severe in a good chunk of Massachusetts (NJ has some massive DR's established!). Wonder how those trees are doing in more severe drought areas this summer.

  • Toronado3800 Zone 6 St Louis
    7 years ago

    Weather girls keep saying we are about 5in down on the year out of maybe 23 or 24 we should have by now. My ground trees are fine in full sun. The pot trees are needing water inbthe shade.

  • Marc
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I bought my Dawn Redwood from a nursery that was going out of business approximately 20 years ago. I live in upstate New York south of Buffalo so our winters can be quite cold. The tree has grown wonderfully. It is approximately 30 ft tall and still growing. The impressive part is the trunk of the tree which is quite wide and knurled. Because the tree is next to my garage I had the lower branches trimmed up about 10 ft. which actually improved the look of the tree - hope no damage was done. Our soil is nothing out of the ordinary - mostly clay. We usually get a fair amount of rain in the area but this season it is on the dry side. I love having something out of the ordinary in my yard

  • User
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I think I planted mine in NJ/Zone 7 in 2010 or so, from a four footer and now it's at least 20 feet tall. This time of day, the sun hits it at a certain angle and the leaves look yellow-green (even though it is the all green species, not a GoldRush, etc.). What's to say. It's impressive still being able to plant trees at a mature age and being able to look forward to a Sequoia a few years down the line!! I just limbed up mine a bit too. Should do NO HARM, btw. But I would encourage you to water as we are about to start a heat wave here in the East and much of the country. They are okay in heat and drought but NOT AS MUCH so as Bald Cypresses. (Which is btw, another terrific tree!) I have about a half dozen each of Bald Cypress and Dawn Reds to be planted out back in the Autumn. Cheers!

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