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Volck VS Neem oil?

Krazy-in-Florida

11 years ago

Hi everyone. I'm new to the citrus side of the forum.

I have 2 Satsuma trees in my yard that I planted years ago. The oldest of the 2 (9 years old) produces blooms and small citrus every year, only to turn yellow and fall off of the tree with in a month. The other issue was that the tree didn't grow much over it's life. I contacted my county agents office and was instructed to fertilize.

I followed their instructions, after all the citrus had fallen off. The tree grew 3' last year. I couldn't believe it. Well the next issue was that all the new leafs curled up bad. Turns out it was leaf miners. They instructed me to spray Volck oil on them.

My question is: Which is better? I read on here where everyone recommends Neem oil.

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Comments (8)

econ0003
11 years ago
I have tried neem oil with spinosad and the citrus leaf miner still seems to damage the leaves on my citrus trees.

My best defense has been to promote flushing of new leaves in the early spring when citrus leaf miner is not active. Then they don't have a chance to damage the leaves.
Krazy-in-Florida
Original Author
11 years ago
Promote flushing?

Could you please elaborate? The miners disfigured my trees so bad I want to make sure I control it this year. All my trees have exploded with new growth and I don't want them to get infected again.
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From the American Camellia Website: "Control of Scale: Scale infestations are more difficult to control when populations are heavy. Homeowners should make spray applications when the first sign of scale is seen. Oil emulsion sprays will give effective control if applied properly. This is a contact insecticide. For it to be effective, the plants must be thoroughly covered (top/bottom of leaves). Oil emulsion sprays should be applied only during the spring and fall when the temperature is 40 - 85Â° F. Spraying in the heat of the day may result in burning the leaves. As a general rule, apply no more than three times per year with at least 60 days in between sprays. Oils are compatible with other insecticides." From Clemson University: "Controls: With a light infestation, scales can be scraped off the plant and discarded. If only a few leaves are infested, hand picking and destruction of infested leaves is very effective. The best time to spray with a refined horticultural oil (Bonide All Season Spray Oil, Ferti-lome Scalecide, Green Light Horticultural Oil Spray, or Ortho Volck Oil Spray) is in spring, after the plants have finished blooming and the danger of cold weather has passed. This will kill many adults, crawlers and eggs by smothering them. Spray two applications, 10 days apart. Spray when temperature are between 40 and 85 degrees. Most insecticides are effective only against the crawlers. In addition, using an insecticide against scales can result in the deaths of naturally occurring enemies of scales. As such, insecticides should be avoided unless the camellia is very valuable. Monitor the crawler emergence with sticky cards, tape wrapped around a branch, or by putting an infested shoot or leaf into a baggie and watching for crawler movement. Crawler activity often coincides with the flush of new plant growth in the spring. However, some scale species may have overlapping generations with an extended crawler emergence period, such as along the coast. Insecticides labeled for homeowner use against tea scale crawlers include acephate (Ortho Japanese Beetle Killer), malathion (Ferti-lome Mal-A-Cide, or Hi-Yield Malathion Insect Spray), cyfluthrin (Bayer Advanced Garden Power Force Multi-Insect Killer), and carbaryl (Sevin 50WP or Ferti-lome Carbaryl Spray). As with all pesticides, read and follow all label instructions and precautions."
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hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
11 years ago
You can treat Citrus Leafminers (CLM) with a combination of Volk oil and Spinosad, but you're going to need to spray very three weeks during your CLM season. The other option is to treat with systemic imidicloprid (Bayer Advanced Fruit and Vegetable Insect Control). Not organic, but very effective on CLM. Just need to apply 2 or 3 weeks before CLM hits in your area, to give it time to get up to the leaves. Then, a second treatment about 4 to 6 months later.

Patty S.
eahamel
11 years ago
Econ, did you mix the spinsad and neem oil? It sounds like that's what you're saying, but you're supposed to use them separately - neem one week, spinosad the next, and keep it up for several weeks.

Patty, I was wondering if you could use imidicloprid on them, that's what we have to use for chili thrips on roses, and the roses don't take up enough to bother the bees, so I don't see how it could get into fruit, since it only lasts 6 weeks or so, and if applied now, it would be gone before fruit are an appreciable size.
Krazy-in-Florida
Original Author
11 years ago
Thanks for all the replies. I checked this stuff out: Bayer Advanced Fruit and Vegetable Insect Control on Patty's recommendation. If it works as advertised, it should be awesome. I am going to try it this week.
econ0003
11 years ago
I alternated spinosad and neem oil every 7-10 days starting in late spring. Still got plenty of damage. I think it was just too hard for me to get 100% coverage on bushy trees.with leaves twisting in every direction.

Some advice I was given when purchasing the spinosad at Grangettos, a farm and garden supply store, was to pinch off the flushes of new growth instead of wasting time spraying.

I didn't do it initially because my trees were too young and I wanted them to put on some size. Now I encourage new growth in the early spring by fertilizing more at that time. The new growth has enough time to harden off before the leaf miners show up. Then fertilize less in the summer and fall, pinching new growth off at that time.

if you are sick of spraying for citrus leaf miner it is a possible alternative to consider.

This post was edited by econ0003 on Mon, Apr 15, 13 at 1:53
eahamel
11 years ago
Pinching off the new growth sounds like a good idea!
johnmerr
11 years ago
Luckily, I don't have CLM here in Guatemala; but I have been told that the CLM just laughs at imidacloprid...could be the strength that the home gardener can buy. Imidacloprid lasts 6 months as a systemic; I give it to my Meyers twice per year, partly as a "protection" against a possible incursion of ACP (asian citrus psyllid), vector of HLB (Citrus greening); it only kills leaf chewing/sucking insects and mostly leaves the beneficials alone.

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