A good "organic" pre-emergent is corn gluten. It is sold under a number of brand names, and is only sold as a granular.

The only drawback to it would be that animals will eat the corn gluten, but from my experience it doesn't harm the animals. (I had a customer who's dog ate all the gluten she could find after she applied it to her garden.)

The only "organic" post-emergent herbicide I have used is potassium salts of fatty acids. It basically burnsdown the foliage, but it is not systemic, and therefore does not kill the roots.

Still looking for any info here....not on the use of or recomendations for "organic" methods...(thanks anyway plantman)...anyone????

Rosa, are you saying that your city is trying to spray too close to the community garden? Are you worried about herbicide drift? It looks like you're trying to avoid starting arguments in the forum, but I think we need a little more detail.

Of course, organic or not isn't really the point here. If you get herbicide drift into the garden, it's going to kill your vegetables and flowers regardless of how you grew them.

The community garden I recently joined is also organic. I guess we're lucky in the geography; the garden takes up essentially a city block. Outside of our fence is about a 12-foot strip of grass that we're responsible for maintaining, then streets, and then it's pretty built-up beyond that, so there's no real place for weeds to become a problem (unless *we* get lazy and let it happen.) We do have to keep it very tidy, though, because our landlord and neighbor on two sides is the state School for the Blind, so we have a real moral obligation to keep the property free of any hazards.

If there's a conflict about weed control versus organic practices, it's probably going to be up to the gardeners to do some extra work so the city/county/state doesn't have a reason to spray. The gardeners are likely going to have to volunteer to maintain their own buffer zone. That's what my garden has been doing for about 20 years or so. Every gardener is required to put in 12 labor hours per year, and my best guess is that 1/3-1/2 of those hours go to maintaining the area outside our fence. It's to everyone's advantage to have that area under control.

And Plantman's comment may be fairly relevant. Depending on the weed that's causing the problems, something like corn gluten could be a solution that will keep everybody happy. It won't drift like a spray herbicide, it won't cause any concern for pets and children in the area, and it's cheaper than most chemical herbicides. You'd need a horticulturalist to tell you whether it'll kill what you want it to kill and when to apply it-- call the county Cooperative Extension advisor.

BTW, if the garden bans pesticides, most people would consider that to include herbicides. It's common usage to say "pesticide" when you mean insecticide, but pesticide is really an umbrella term for insecticide, herbicide and fungicide (and maybe some other -cide that I can't remember at almost 1 am.)

Good luck! I think if everybody's willing to take a deep breath and try to see each other's point of view, you'll find that you all want the same result and it's just a matter of agreeing on a route to get there.

We are contracted by the city of Buffalo, NY to develop sustainable - or what you may refer to as organic - gardens/vacant lots.
We ar currently under contract for two new development projects wherein the properties were formerly drug houses and were abandoned and taken over by the city, torn down and given to the local community or in this case the Weed and Seed office - a branch of the US Dept of Justice office.

Our city ordinances do not permit any synthetic pesticides on public property - period.

We design and develop these lots as SUSTAINABLE projects.

You need to focus on the:
- soil quality - test it
- location of the lot
- pollution
- winter exposure
- intended function and use of the lot
Of the lots we have designed and developed, none have been vegetable gardens - these are to high maintenance and temporary.
- PROPER site preparation
- PROPER plant selections
- PROPER planting and installation
- Follow up training to the community

It's imperative to prep the site and use plants that are sustainable. This will drastically mitigate the need for any use of pesticides or synthetic products in the future. Also, remember, there will be NO perfect lot or plan. some will always have losses or an unexpected disease, etc... You have to re-evaluate your tolerance level.

Community EDUCATION is key when you are done.

with proper assessments, designs, planning, plant selection, installation and follow up training you will be well on your way to creating a sustainable landscape in your community.

Dave

I am involved with the community gardens in Ann Arbor Michigan. Our gardens are called "organic" and for us that means no synthetic pesticides, herbicides or fertilizers used on the plots. I don't think any are used on the grounds nearby our gardens but if there were, I think we would still say our gardens are gardened organically.
Kirk

I had posted a message however, it did not paste.
I do community gardening within two community gardens .. In one of these comm. gardens, I have 80 + fellow gardeners from which only over a hand full practice safe organic gardening practices, the rest do not believe, and are not encourage to do so. In this case my humble opinion is that none of the members of the garden council garden organically and are not open for this practices, and have been in existance since 1975. -Whereas the other community garden I also garden, there are only 22 plots, in existance since 1997, I am a volunteer garden council,and a charter member of such community garden, since we frist broke ground we have encouraged fellow gardeners to practice the organic safe methods available to us. -95 % of fellow gardeners have listened. -I believe that one needs to take responsibility to learn and inform ourselves with as much information and education for these safe methods, Mother Earth deserves our respect. Grow Organic! -Do not treat your soil like DIRT !

I returned to one of my town's community gardens this year, after a 3 or 4 year hiatus. During that time, the rules were changed to prohibit non-organic pest controls. I haven't a detailed rule, however. Many (most?) people seem to use chemical fertilizers, but going to organic pest management seems to have drastically reduced the number of bad insects. Unfortunately, several of the older gardeners I liked are also gone and I wonder if the new pesticide rules drove some them away. I learned a lot from some of them and will miss them, but not their pesticides. Good insects move around a lot and it used to be tough to grow organically in the midst of all that Sevin dust. The link is to the town's community garden pages.

Here is a link that might be useful: West Hartford Community Gardens

For years I belonged to a community garden in Capitola, California. (moved 3 years ago) It was organic which meant no chemical pesticides or herbicides. I don't believe they sprayed the lawn on the adjacent soccer field. I don't know what the town's practices were, but they were pretty clear about organic only within the garden. You may contact them for more info.

Wow, haven't checked back in some time...

I'm just trying to determine if your community garden has any herbicide or pesticide products sprayed or applied nearby (by the city/county/ or parks people). It could be herbicide for specific weed control, insecticide for any pest control or even weed and feed for the soccer field next door. If so, then what is the distance from the garden the product is used that still allows the garden to be called organic?

I can see some communities do not allow spraying of any pesticide at all on public land and others, like mine, do. But the question is how far from the gardens is it used and what is the product if known.

Our city uses herbicides and that's not going to change-no one is looking to make a change yet. Just interested in gathering info on how other community gardens are managed with respect to this. I would ask what your gardens consider to be the safe distance when using pesticides and still be organic but believe that this would spurn too much philosophical debate and "safe" is a subjective term for most. Not interested in that kind of contentious discussion!!

Thanks for all the info!!
Rosa

My garden in in a privatly owned cemetary (my oldest says there is a horror movie that starts with "I'm going to the gardens by myself"). They don't spray or fertlize much as they would have to pay for it and there is no need but that doesn't mean that they couldn't if they wanted to.

I would like to establish an organic area of the garden but that would require changing plots and I bet it wouldn't happen.

Tracy

i am interested in participating in an organic community garden in the Louisville, KY area....anyone know of garden areas around me? thanks.