Was there turf under the boxes? If so, you first want to remove it. Tilling it in will create wet spots and you won't get a good garden until the turf fully decomposes.
If you don't have to deal with the turf issue just disassemble and take the boxes away and till the 'topsoil' into the subsoil along with a couple bags of manure and bark fines (soil conditioner). That should give you some decent tilth so your hot weather plants like tomatoes and peppers can get their roots down to absorb moisture.
Be sure your location is getting maximum sunshine. Tomatoes and peppers want lots of light and heat.

I guess the answer to your question is first to buy a small tiller or a Mantis.

Check 'Lasagne Gardening' out of your local library, it is an amazingly easy way to garden.

Both methods will work, I did the lasanga thing without the newspaper and the plants grew beautifully. Requires a lot of organic matter though; I could do it because I've got two horses who stay in stalls overnight. Several counties offer leaf mold and compost for free or at minimal prices.

there's a thread that has dropped back to page 2 (what can i do in january?) started by another gardener starting with clay soil - it has a lot of good suggestions & comments you may find helpful.

welcome to carolina :)

Thanks Chapelhillgardener, I read the January post. Everyone there is talking about red clay. I'm familiar with red clay as that's mostly what we have in GA.

Our soil here is grey clay. It does not drain AT ALL. Hubby dug a spot for a step foundation. It rained the day after about two months ago and there's been water there since. I really think I could sell the stuff to some of the many potters around here to make million dollar sculptures.

Is there any hope in my yard for a garden other than raised beds?

grey clay. no drainage. yuck. i suppose you have two options: dig deep & ammend OR dig a little & amend enough for good drainage and start raising beds on top. i've got several different kinds of clay here and lack of drainage issues in some areas, too - because i have unlimited access to leaf compost, i've gone the raised-bed route, supplementing the compost with excess soil from other projects and sharp sand.

is your property ALL grey clay? or do you have a variety of soils like many of us do in the pittsboro/chapel hill area?

It's all grey clay and rocks....YUCK!!!! I'm probably going to try building a series of berms to plant on.

I'm new to this site. Where do I go to get info on building a compost pile?

here's the composting/soils forum link.
check the FAQ's for that forum - they may provide
answers to your questions.

Here is a link that might be useful: soils & composting forum

Check in the soil compost and mulch forum. The FAQs there will help with composting and I think they also have one on lasagne gardening. Are those rocks in your landscape big enough to use for garden edging? Adele

Most are not Adele. They're about 2-3 inches at most. The people who lived here before have them stacked around trees in the yard. They look kind of like that horror film where people stacked the rocks.....

I've checked the compost forum but I really need step-by-step, holding my hand directions on getting it started. I don't know the difference in brown and green or how to balance the ratio...???? Hot versus cold? How to shred cardboard etc......

I'm accustomed to planting in an established garden my parents have used for 40 years. I'm lost in my new space.

Sounds like you have a difficult situation. You really can't til in ammendments easily if there are lots of rocks and sounds like they aren't big enough to be good for much. I would definately work one bed at a time and try to get them right. You sound like a good candidate for lasagna gardening.
Compost is easy. Don't let the ratios scare you too much. It's easier to make a hot compost with a larger pile. They compost quicker. You can start with leaves (best if shredded with a mower or something) and add all your vegetable kitchen scraps. (Not meat or dairy, but you can add rinsed eggshells) You can add grass clippings if you don't want to leave them on the lawn. I set a pile of shredded leave next to my compost and sprinkle it over the top whenever I add green/vegetable matter. I have plenty of leaves so I don't add paper but you could substitute shredded newspaper or cardboard. I find paper products are slower to break down. I do leave the coffee filters in when I compost the grounds. My compost is fairly cool because it's not covered, so I will probably cover it soon to speed things up. I turn it every week. You have to turn it to let air in or you get stinky compost. Sprinkling fresh leaves on top after you add scraps or turn also seems to help. I try to get the approximate ratios right, but I don't worry about it too much and it does fine. It takes a while and a lot of material to make a small amount of compost. But the compost is so good for the garden that even a little is worth it. I also get pleasure from knowing that I am reducing waste to landfills and putting it back in to nature. Good luck, and don't be scared. Just do it and if you have problems you can usually figure out what is causing them and fix it. -Ais.

Welcome to NC! I had the same problems. I gave up on trying to get rid of the rocks and built up with raised beds. I now have 4 4x16 beds and an 8x8 for rhubarb and a 4x8 for strawberries. It can be done with less effort. You really should look into the raised bed or lasagne gardening if you don't want pull out all of those rocks. Raised beds have several benefits. They are easy to weed and you can usually get an earlier start on them if you get like me and need the outdoor time. I am as north as you can be and still be in NC so I appreciate any help I can get.

It looks like that's what I'm going to do immrlizard. I've read and read and read until I've decided I'm going to do more raised beds. I currently have three 4x8 beds. DH is gonna have to get to building more for me!

You are on the right track! Gray clay means that oxygen is not getting into the soil, for whatever reason. Very little will thrive under those conditions. Raised beds and lasagna beds are the key to your success.

Go to a tree removal service and purchase a truck load of mulch (preferebly hardwood). They usually sell for $10. Till the clay and mix in the mulch. You will have drainage and organic components as well.

I'll give you my lazy@ssed gardener's 2 cents - don't kill yourself. Use the raised bed frames you already have and don't build more just yet. Build some sort of holding area to stockpile compostables because you are gonna need a lot of it (we all do, it is something you can never have too much of). You'll want to have a handy pile of coarse sand, of ground up leaves or grass clippings, and possibly store bought compost or compost/topsoil blend that you have trucked in and dumped.

You want really tall raised bed walls (I've seen them as high as 3 feet with a ledge wide enough to sit on while you weeded) so if yours aren't more than one board high you might consider raising them.

You want the most perfect soil blend you can come up with inside at least one of the raised beds by this spring. You can either do lots of hauling and mixing to all the raised beds you have or move all the good soil you have now into one of the beds - whatever it takes to make it really deep. You can grow enough vegetables to feed a family of four in one of your beds if you manage the crops correctly and keep it weeded and watered all summer long. If you move all your soil into one bed, use the others as large low compost bins and build up your soil. Soil is the key to gardening.

Remember that an immense pile of compostable matter becomes a small pile of compost. So you want to pile it on really deep and let it cook down all year. Leaves are the same way, a pile the size of a small car can be ground down and fit into one large trash bag. It takes tons of matter to make enough compost for a garden the size you are contemplating. Don't bite off so much hard work right off the bat. Take baby steps. Master one bed and then move on to the next.

Plenty of gardens have the exact same clay soil you describe. The difference is that it is buried many feet down under layers of sandy loam and topsoil. If you dig around in your grey clay you will only make low spots that never drain well. It is better to build UP rather than try to change such a large area of bad soil. I have seen small scale farms built on mounded rows of good topsoil built up on clay. It allowed things to drain and only the mounds were maintained. But these people were using farming equipment not handtools.

Do any weeds grow in this grey clay soil?? If weeds can grow there, crops can grow there too.

Thanks for your input. The flower beds are raised around the house and the ones I added last year out in the yard are raised as well. Visitors this year may think they're looking at an odd perennial and it may just be a tomato plant or perhaps a bell pepper! I'm gonna plant where ever I can while I'm working on the "official" gardening spot.

Weeds do grow here in the 1 inch of topsoil . I guess the bright side to that is they're easy to pull! They really like the flower beds though. We have bare spots all over our yard where grass won't grow because the topsoil has washed away. When I tell you it's bad....I mean every word of it to the 100th degree!

I've started "trying" to add compost to two of my three beds. I've been studying up on the subject but have yet to find step by step instructions to get the balance needed. I have a few chickens so I added the shavings and poo, coffee grounds and filter, fruit leftovers and a little shredded paper. We do have TONS of grass clippings around the edge of our yard from the previous occupants. We have woods all around us so leaves are in endless supply. I know I have the resources all around me but lack the knowledge on how to put them together. I just don't know how to get things "hot". Can you recommend a good step-by-step, hold-my-hand book for me?

Lost, I think one of the key ingredients to composting is the "wet as a wrung out sponge" adage. All the things you mentioned are great. If you mix them together and water it when it is dry you should get some nice compost. The key ingredients being the water, coffee grounds and chicken doodle for the heat and with your supply of leaves, grass clippings and kitchen scraps you have the makings of a nice compost pile. Once you have them mixed up together an occasional watering and turning of the pile with a garden fork should be all you need. You have all the ingredients. Now you go girl. Adele

Emily Compost is on my list of sites i visit frequently ... the link below will take you to a great article on composting - there's a nice list of "greenies" and "brownies"

marsha

Here is a link that might be useful: composting article

I think the real key to a hot compost is to make it big. I think 4' x 4' x 3'deep would be great. My compost pile isn't that big and doesn't heat up much except with lots of vegetable matter. But this fall we got a tree service to dump a load of shredded trees (small branches, leaves, pineneedles, small logs all chipped together). We used it to spread on our paths and after a couple of days the pile was HOT. It steamed when we spread it. The pile was mainly wood so I think the key here was the size of it. There is still a small pile of it left and it's not hot at all. Sound like you could use a lot of compost anyways so a big pile is good for you. The FAQ section of the soil, mulch and compost forum may help you get started. Good luck. -Ais.

Here is a link that might be useful: brief intro to composting

You don't even necessarily have to "build" raised beds. What really keeps the soil in place is plant roots, not rock and wood surrounding the soil. The dirt washes out of the cracks in retaining walls during heavy rains unless there are plant roots there to hold it in place.

in maryland, we built 3'+ high raised beds for vegetables, and they dried out very quickly ... the drainage was just *too good*.

There isn't one way to make compost - there are a million ways to make compost. Some people like to turn and fluff and water and sprinkle activators onto their bins or piles while others simply pile it up and let nature take care of it the slow way (takes at least a year).

Leaves work best if ground up but grinding them up takes a lot of time - so you can choose which way suits you. Keep in mind that somewhere in that mixture of dry leaves is poison ivy leaves which will cause a problem down the road when you go to mix it in. People that are sensitive to poison ivy tend to be extra carefull with their use of leaves. I have poison ivy rashes somewhere on my body at all times of the year.

You can also toss the lawn clippings in with the chickens and let them scratch and nibble it - chickens can turn a compost pile much more efficiently than a human. You'll have potting soil in a month with the help of the chickens.

john
you are so right about chickens being the ultimate composters. i took an area of the chicken yard and bordered it with logs to contain everything - all last summer i threw weeds and leaves in there, this fall i tossed in a few bales of straw & hay - what i have now is a huge area of broken-down black dirt. manure-fortified, even :)

I never thought of letting my chickens earn their keep! The beds are inside the electronic fence so I can't just put them out there because the dogs will have them for a meal but I can take the clippings to them!!! I'm gonna do that today.

I LOVE this site!

what we have in our backyard can't even be called dirt--when we moved here 3 years ago our backyard was a sloping, swampy mess. i had to hire someone to fix a pipe that caused drainage from the street to dump into our yard. i wanted to level off the severe slope by trucking in some soil but couldn't afford it. my contractor, knowing this, kept his eye out for free dirt. he convinced some of the guys who were excavating dirt near downtown durham to dump their dirt into my yard (instead of paying to dump it). the contractor then leveled it all out with a bobcat. so now my backyard is nice and flat, although the dirt is of the worst quality.

to grow crops, i fashioned two "planter boxes" out of cinder blocks and filled them with nice soil, soil conditioner, and compost (after laying several layers of newspaper). yields weren't that great--i blame the extreme drought and high temps for that. i'm expecting to do better this year. last year i planted tomatoes and raspberries; this year i'll build more boxes and will add more crops.

pat
durham NC

There is nothing better for breaking up nasty old clay than chicken poop and sand.

As for composting, I set up a ring of hog wire about 4 feet in diameter and 3 feet high. In that goes leaves, kitchen scraps, coffee grounds & the filters, which I tear into pieces, chicken litter (hay, poop, their old feed & scratch that is a mess on the floor, cedar chips, leaves, or whatever). I even clean out the sink drains strainer goop and put in there. Sprinkle on a 1/2 shovel of dirt (to add micro-organisms that help activate things) and then cover that with more leaves or leaf mold. Layer it like that over and over until it is pilled high and deep. The higher the better.

Now, water it in until it is good and wet - Spongey. I just set my sprinkler on top and leave it for 20 minutes or so. If you get ample rain, you won't need to water it that much. I also empty my pet water into the compost and the chickens water, when I change it out. Weeds, green grass clippings, annual grass you pull up out of your garden beds, or anything like that provides your green matter.

The chicken poop provides the heat and I mean fast! No need to cover it. It is much colder here in Oklahoma and my compost pile heats up and breaks down rapidly, even on the very coldest days. You can see the steam rising out of the compost in the mornings.

You can use newspaper (not the color glossy sales pull-outs though). I tear into pieces or cut up into small pieces all of my paper trash, including cereal boxes, papertowels, macaroni & cheese boxes, pizza boxes, prescriptions labels (torn up or cut into pieces), prescription packages, paper grocery bags, or anything paper. I put them into a large bucket, add water, and let that sit over night. By morning, it has softened and can go right into my compost, water and all. Cover it with more hay or leaves. The worms love it and move in really soon. Every once in awhile, add some more leaves and chicken litter to keep it fueled. You will be surprised just how much less trash you will have to throw away each day, especially if you are already recycling bottles and plastics!

If it cools down, stir in some more chicken litter/poop or add a little dab of fertilizer or composted manure. Once a weak, I give it a toss and fluff it up a bit. The frequent turning will also keep it from packing down and just rotting and that will prevent it from stinking or drawing flies and critters.

I'll shut up now. Hopes this helps. It's how I do things, anyhow.

~Annie

My neighborhood doesn't allow chickens (or goats to my husbands despair, though my garden is thankful) =( -Ais.

I forgot to mention-
In addition to scratch, I give my chickens fresh greens (chopped up weeds, grass etc), some kitchen scraps, canned cat food, and toss in straw and leaves. There are always nice bugs in the leaves. They scratch around in it and just love searching for goodies. Once in awhile I wet their run down if we don't get ample rain or snow, just to keep it "cooking". The chickens like how it warms their feet.

By Spring, it is pretty well composted down and I shovel out the chicken run and pile it in the kitchen garden right next to the chicken run. If it is still too hot, you will smell an ammonia smell. If so, don't use it right away! It is too hot. Pile it up, add straw and water it and let it continue to compost down until it just smells like good, rich dirt. It doesn't take long - maybe a week or two at most.

Then I start the pen again with fresh hay, leaves (which I bagged in the Fall), and so on. Adding fresh hay, cedar chips, dry leaves periodically also keeps their run smelling clean. Of course, they run loose during most of the day, unless I plan to be gone or something.

You can also do this same thing right on the ground where you plan to build your garden. Add chicken poop, leaf mold, straw, leaves, sand and grass clippings - wet it good and let it cook. It will break up the clay, but you just have to keep adding manures and sand or leaf mold. You can also add sheep manure, goat, rabbit, cow, horse, peacock poop, or whatever.

I am getting some guineas "keets" this spring. I have a little hen that is very motherly and likes to set, so will let her raise the keets. Chicken hens help to domesticate gunieas keets. Guineas are the best bug eaters and snake eaters you can get, and they don't sratch up your garden or flowers beds like chickens do. They eat ticks and fleas far better than chickens. They also are good "Watch Dogs". They will simultaneously all raise a ruckous if someone comes into your yard. They roost in the trees and don't have to be pampered like chickens and lay very fine small eggs, if you can find their clutch, that is.

That's all.
Have a great day! :)
~Annie in Okie

I had terribly rocky, clayey soil in my Alabama yard when we moved in. I could not till the soil as it was very hard to dig. Not even weeds grew in it. I marked off an area for beds using cheap landscape timbers. I threw shredded leaves, grass clippings and gypsum (available from Lowes) in it. I then planted perennials that were drought tolerant and not particular as to the soil-sedums, Rudbeckia, Delosperma, Ceratostigma etc and watered them whenever I could. Gradually, earthworms moved in-they slowly turned over the soil. I now have nice rich black soil, with some rocks, in my beds. I can now grow several different perennials and annuals. Susan.

We went to Carrboro Public Works today and got a truckload full of leaf compost. It seems to be some pretty good stuff. It was steaming as DH put it in the truck. Before we left I took a bucket and added all the kitchen scraps I'd been saving for the past couple of days. Coffee grounds, torn up paper towels, citrus peels, banana peels, potato peels, splenda packets, etc. I also emptied the paper shredder in the bucket. I added water and let everything moisten up while we went to get the compost.
When we got home I put a layer of newspapers and a pizza box on the ground. I piled on some leaves, empties the bucket and put more leaves. I then cleaned out the chicken coop and put that on the pile. I mixed it together as best as I could. I didn't realize it but I already had compost of sorts underneath the hay in the chicken run. I put some of that in the pile as well.

As far as guineas, I just gave away 10 of them two weeks ago. Hubby couldn't stand the noise so they had to go. I'm getting a couple of geese tomorrow. How well are they at composting???

lost
sounds like you are well on the way, now!
maybe i'll see ya at the carrboro compost pile :)
marsha

Geese can be great weeders - they prefer grass over anything else in the garden. But they are often so heavy that they trample garden plants. Certain breeds are pretty noisy too (they sing a different tune but at the same volume as guineas). You can feed them all your weeding if you don't wanna let them roam.

My only problem with Guineas is that the flock has some pretty extreme politics. If one member gets injured or sick the other hens will attack it and kill it (they don't want an injured member to slow them down). Too brutal for me but I did enjoy the way they would race down the driveway to meet when I drove home from work (they were really after the grasshoppers my car tires had gathered on the way up the hill).

Welcome to NC! When I moved to NC 20 old years ago I met a wonderful gardening friend who told me about the no dig method using leaves, newspapers(no color pages!) etc.. You won't have to till either unless you want to. Below is a link I found. It is for New Zealand, but it will work here too. It gives very simple steps on how to garden in clay. It's really very easy once you get all of your materials together. Be patient and let the worms and nature do it's work. Good luck. LindaNC

Here is a link that might be useful: No dig gardening

I can tell you from experience that it's futile to try to improve the grey clay for planting. I have small areas with it in my flower border that I've been working mulch/compost/sand into for 10 years and it hasn't improved the aeration enough to successfully plant. I have been hauling it out bit by bit as I plant new perrenials and replace it with good soil. I think raised beds is the way to go for you.