picture is worth a thousand words

Sorry - just getting a photo account set up:

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CC,can't tell for sure from the small plant photo,but you might try going to WWW.FCBS.ORG and look at photos of the Dyckia shown there,and see which one resembles your plant,and has the orange flowers.You will likely get an ID.
A close-up photo of the dyckia leaves would help us too.
Bob

kinda looks like Dyckia tuberosa

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:504148}}

Chris. on the FCBS site,the closest pic to yours that I found was D.encholirioides,a species dyckia.It too has orange flowers,and they are bunched in groups on the red stem,like your photo.
Bob

Hi Bob and Hotdiggetydam,
I had not considered tuberosa because this plant has different leaves to the picture ob FCBS, but encholirioides is a strong possibility - thank you both. Weather permitting i will take a better picture of the leaves and see if that will help. I was told it was hardy - but in cactus talk that can sometimes mean 'hardy if kept dry'. Nevertheless I have split it and will try some out in the spring. The only hardy broms seem to be Fascicularias - at least here in Cheshire, UK.

Best regards

Chris

Just come back from a trip, have some interesting pics to show you all in this forum on Monday.

Hello Chris, glad to meet spiny lover friend :-)
For the ID, I've read a description in a book : 'Bromeliads' by Victoria Padilla, wrote;

"...Dyckia ursina L.B. Smith 1943
(er-sign'a) Bearlike, reffering to the brown wool on petals.

From Minas Gerais, Brazil, where it is found high in the mountains,
exposed to extreames of heat and cold.

A lage plant with leaves two feet in length and a flower spike 3-4 feet in hight.
The distinguishing characteristic of this species is the brown wool,
1/8 inch thick, that covers the branched spike and part of the inflorescence.
The petals are orange."

There are two pic of this species in FCBS,
though they are rather not look alike at first glance,
but the different growth condition, also a natural variation could be overlooked
by the most specific characteristic, the brown wool.

Hope that your plant could set seed, I would be glad to swob some with mine.

That is a real good possibility Stephania [D.ursina],but we really need to see an up-close of Chris's plant leaves to see if it matches up to D.ursina,whose leasves are a bit unusual, being upright,compared to most dyckias.And it would be kind of rare for that species to have found its way to England,but,you never know.Look how many are in Thailand! :-) You would think there was a great collector there,would'nt you? lol,
Bob

Hi Stephania,
Many thanks for your help, it kind of fits with the suggestion that it was hardy here in the UK as I find the name on a possibly hardy list. Below should be the photo (I'm still getting the hang of it - boy this is a GREAT site and I'm enjoying reading through the old posts).
The plant was split up and I've got spares if you would like one. There were a few seeds but I cannot find them at the moment. The suugestion certainly goes well with the hairyness of the flower/stem.
The plant goes a bit darker in the sun that it is pictured.
The leaves are only about 30cm at best but that may be my growing conditions.

Best regards and thanks

Chris

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I think, Dyckia is among the most variable xeric bromeliad.
I have dozens of different characteristic of Dyckia marnier-lapostollei.
Also the different growth condition could make a great different result too.

Chris, could you tell us, where or how you got your Dyckia or xeric brom.
I myself never heard of any dealer in UK, who sell xeric brom, except a seed supplier.

I would like to see your xeric brom collection too.
I noticed that you also collect succulent plants.
You know, I'm an avid caudex plant hunter too !!!

Hi Stephania,
I bought the plant - unlabelled - at a show - actually from a car boot. The seller said it was 'hardy' and on the basis that it was a nice plant and I would be able to split it and try it out outside I bought it. Since then it has had two flower spikes and I've made several plants from it. One is in a cold frame for the winter - its first step towards the garden. The only other brom I manage outside is Fascicularia - this is totally hardy as far as I can tell and has been out for about 10 years in pots as well as planted out. (pic below).
I have noticed D. ursina listed as hardy (http://www.oasisdesigns.co.uk/hardy_broms.htm) so maybe...
Other than that I grow some succulent broms like Dyckia m-l, Hechtia M-L plus a load of others that I generally put outside for the summer and move back in under the benches for the winter. Tillandsias also go out for the summer and hang round the garden though I have not tried one out for the winter (until this year when a spare burgeri is taking its chance). I put many agaves outside for the summer although a few are hardy) and gastertias and haworthias. Plenty of yuccas including endlichiana, again many are hardy. Lots of cacti and succulents, including a few caudiciforms (e.g. anacapmseros alstonii and comptonii). Carnivorous plants - and also in a wet bed outdoors along with orchids. I grow a lot from seed so the list does change over a long period. I also like monstrose plants - so I collect those where I like them. Lots of bulbs of course. I must say it is not as neat as your stunning collection!

Best regards

Chris

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Hi Stephania,
I forgot to mention three things:
1) The defunct UK bromeliad society used to be run from not far from here - so maybe plants came in from there - and the woman (whos name i forget) gave us a couple of excellent talks.
2) I'm am looking for others growing xeric broms and tillandsias in the UK.
3) Thanks to this site - I'm working my way back through the topics and althogh some photos dissapear as the topics get older this is a really enjoyable site - many thanks to all.

Best regards

Chris

ps the offer of a piece of the Dyckia still stands. Also I have a plant labelled Dyckia chaguar - do you know anything about it?

Chris here's a link on a couple of your plants. Source is in the UK

Here is a link that might be useful: chaguar

Hi hotdiggeydam,
Thanks for the link. I have not used this nursery but know them from many shows. I was really asking about the origins of the plant as I find little on it on the net. It does well outside fro the summer so it keeps a good place on the staging. Do you know if it i9s a good species or a clonal form, or a hybrid?
I have never flowerd it - but then there is a fisrt time for everything - I noticed that one of my (dozen or so) Welwitschias is starting to produce a cone I think - long awaited - and very welcome.

Best regards
Chris

Love that blue flower Fascicularia, I've never seen a real one before,
this must be in my want list :-)

You and the other in US are luckier than me, as there is no bromeliad society here.
Nobody that I could talk to, particularly the xeric brom topic.
May be only me or at least one or two guy, who grow xeric broms,
among 60 million Thai people here !!! :-(

Fortunately, as you, I found this great site and a lot of good friends here.

Hey...Chris, could you show me your "Chaguar", how does it look.

Contact the sellers Chris for more info. One thing I did read some where is info on Dyckia floribunda is related in some way to Chaguar although Im not sure of the connection.
ck here for photo

Here is a link that might be useful: photo

Chaguar is the common name of several related species of South American plants of the family Bromeliaceae, among them Bromelia serra, Bromelia hieronymi, Deinacanthon urbanianum and Pseudananas sagenarius, which are non-woody forest plants with sword-shaped evergreen leaves, resembling yucca. The different varieties grow in the semi-arid parts of the Gran Chaco ecoregion.

I will take a photo this wekend when there is some day light.

Best regards

Chris

Here are a few photos;
Hechtia marnier-laostollei
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Dyckia Britannia
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Hechtia scariosa ISIxxx
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Dyckia chaguar
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A small caudiciform - Anacapseros comtonii
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A tray of mixed plants
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Wow...love all of your spinies !...a caudex too,
but that species is difficult to grow here in hot Bangkok city!

Your Hechtia manier-lapostoei is really prolific clone.
If I had that, I will let them grow to be a big clump.

Dyckia Britannia and Chagua are neat, also Hechtia scariosa is really pretty,
I've never seen these lovely spinies before.

Is that, silver leaf plant in the last pic, Deuterocohnia longipetala ?
It look like one that I got from Tropiflora.

Hechtia scariosa is now Hechtia texensis I just got a few of those spiny's

D.chaguar = D.floribunda seems the original seed were collected in Huntington Gardens LA and easily as the hybidize in cultivation...........someone sowed their wild oats as it were LOL

Yes Stephania - D. longipetala - I have a couple of different plants of this. I need to propagate H marnier-lapostollei because it is my only plant at the moment.

Thanks hotdiggetydam - explains a lot.

I've lost track of the original question - is the concensus now that it is D.ursina or are there others with hairy scapes?

Best regards

Chris

Chris. Regards to the 'original question',I'm going with the opinion that you have D.ursina there instead of D.encholirioides.Your pic does show the leaves in a mostly upright position,as in ursina,and the fuzzy brown sepals are very convincing. How such a scarce plant got to England is a good question.
Some other opinions:
Looking closely at the D.chaguar pic,I see white verticle lines on the leaf underside,and think it may have some D.brevifolia in it,or be a variety of it,tho it seems to be larger than the normal D.brevifolia. I'm still confused by the 'chaguar'name,as hdd pointed out,is a 'group of related' plants. I visualize some tour guide in SA,refering to a mixture of 'spiney' plants as being all'chaguars',his term for plants with spines.And thats how any spine plant from that local area got named,no matter what it really was.You never know.
#2- I have a feeling that H.scariosa is different enough from H.texensis to not have its named changed.[see hdd's post on being the same plant]. H.texensis spines are smaller,and pointed directly out,and seldom red,if at all.Whereas D.scariosa spines are larger,and hooked shaped,and very red. I'd keep it ID'd as D.scariosa...it even sounds better for such a 'bloody'plant.
Bob

Ck the FCBS site thats where I found the name change information. Was meant to be information only.

Thanks Bob,
I will put the name with the plant. I can only assume that it was my proximity to the European bromeliad chairman (I think her name was Jaquie Watts ??) that may have been the input point. I am also an eagle eye when looking at sales trays at cactus society events and perhaps the import was related to the British cactus society - there are very few bromeliad lovers in the society - and in fact many calls have gone out to the shows committee (I was a society judge for many years and can recall lively discussion about this) to include bromeliads in the shows handbook - and astonishingly depite the obvious benefit the shows committee always refused to allow bromeliads into the handbook. I have propagated it and of a couple of plants I gave to a friend one will be heading for 'someone who knows' (I don't know his name) so that may also lend weight to the identification.
This has been a great thread for me and thanks to all who have helped - any further opinions are still welcome - I have to say this forum has been a great find for me and spurred me on to more quickly extend my brom collection.

Best regards

Chris

Given the new pictures on the FCBS of Dyckia ursina is the opinion still that the plant above is D. ursina?? The leaves in the FCBS article look to be much greener and less silvery as well as longer, and the flowers much more bunched up with the petals less prominent......the flower scape of mine appears to be covered in brown scales rather than whitish ones and my plants leaves are not nearly so upright.

FCBS article by Oscar Ribeiro

Cadeia do Espinhaço
Habitats
The Flora and Fauna of the Serra do Cipó and Diamantina
Chapter II
http://fcbs.org/articles/pimg.htm

Hi guys, to sy who is who on Dyckias by a picture is too much too risky. Maybe the plant hade some Dyckia fosterian in its "blood". How much? Nobody will know. Dyckia cross in open gardens is absolutely a matter of mother nature who knows.
Some Dyckia plant must be totally dismantled to be recognized.
There is no other genere as difficult as Dyckias to classify.
When taxonomists made their work in a kind of hurry they got sorry later. You must be a extremely well skilled magician to say something sure about a hybrid Dyckia. Also the one who created the plant may be in a kind of embroil to arim something absolutely conclusive about some Dyckia hybrids. Fancy names says nothing and normally turn thing even worst. When we deal with Dyckia hybrids just a few things are absolutely safe to say and many just after the plant has bloomed (A Dyckia doesn´t show its final mask before blooming.)We , nevertheless, may always say. I like it or I don´t. That may be safe, maybe...

Here is a link that might be useful: Dyckia Brazil

Oh my ! No, no and no and no again. Dyckia ursina ( Latim for like a bear)flower has a dark cotton like structure among the its flowers. The flowers open within this cotton. This flower here is very close to those of the Dyckia fosteriana, close but not equal.
You have a Dyckia, no doubt. Maybe has a Dyckia fosteriana long behind the scene....
IT IS A HYBRID DYCKIA! I know no species that ressembles to it. Nurseries open fertilize and over hybridize the already hybrids plants. They use seeds that were made in open area. Barely they may know who is who and most of all they don´t even know what they might have. This is a Charming Dyckia hybrid. Maybe a grand, grand, grand. grand, grandmother brother was a Dyckia fosteriana but even so it is the closest it can get to a species. Ok? No this is not ursina. The only Dyckia species with cotton like structures on their flowers sticks are: Dyckia ursina and Dyckia alba and this is nothing to the plant here shown. It has no cotton like structure just some dots. Dyckia ursina besides the curious flowering is a drab with no grace Dyckia species lookning much alike a plain grass.