Older hybrid teas slower to establish?
melodyinz8a
9 years ago
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Comments (18)
roseseek
9 years agoingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
9 years agoRelated Discussions
Older Hybrid Teas
Comments (26)Well, I'll tell you all what happened. I tried to order all these roses directly from the Vintage site. However, the site was VERY slow and when I was almost finished, the shoping cart crashed and I got a message that said there was a technical problem and to send Gita an e-mail with the list of roses, and they would hand process the order and call for credit card number. I did that. On Sunday evening, the last day of the sale, I tried to order again from the site just for the heck of it. I though maybe it had gotten fixed. This time the site was satisfactory in speed, and just as I was finishing up the shopping cart, it crashed again. Technical problem message again. I sent another e-mail, with the message that I would like to modify the original order a bit. I also left a couple of phone messages, in which I said I would give them the credit card info over the phone directly to them "in person". I have not heard back from Vintage. Do you suppose I am getting a message from my guardian angel about these roses? Sandy...See Morei am not a fan of hybrid teas...
Comments (60)I think adding lots of compost to the soil is very important for any rose, they respond to it by growing a few new canes every year. I noticed it after I started mulching my rose beds with mushroom compost instead of wood mulch; its much cheaper for me too. Of course, rose growth benefits a lot from plenty of water (especially when it gets really hot and dry) and enough fertilizer. It's true that some HTs are genetically bushier than others. But I also believe in pruning. I don't think every Ht should be chopped down to 12 inches. I prune every rose, including HTs, differently depending on their growth habit. Ill give examples for the three roses I posted pictures of. No matter how much Ill fight, Peter Mayle wants to be very tall. His canes are very fat and strong, so they support nicely 3 foot or longer new spring growth. So I cut off about 2/3 of the canes leaving about 3 foot tall central canes with a cut made above the outward growing bud. The outer canes are cut more (on any rose), leaving maybe 2 feet, to form a nice shape. After a spring hair cut Peter looks kind of oval all around, this way hell grow flowers not only on the top. I try not to leave canes looking like long sticks. I try to cut above the places when the main canes branching out. I know, its not recommended leaving any branches growing inside of the bush and letting them cross with other branches, but I do not follow this rule. First of all, every branch will make a few new branches and the bush itself will look very full, well foliated, and produce more flowers. Secondly, next spring all those mechanically damaged from wind and rubbing each others canes will be cut off anyway. If at spring pruning time, a cane looks aged or damaged, Im not scared to cut it off all the way to the graft, because I know that as soon as a rose looses one of the main canes, it sends a few new ones to replace the lost cane. It is recommended to cut off all weak side growth of the main canes. I do not do that. Those weak short branches are good for growing foliage to cover the lower part of the canes. Yves Piaget does not throw long strong canes, it has more graceful habit of growing, and it likes to be wider than taller. It is already a well-developed and mature plant. So the purpose of pruning in this case is to shape it up. I trim off only a foot or a foot and a half, as much as is needed to make the rose pretty from all sides. This spring I had to cut off two major canes, and now Yves is growing, probably seven new canes. It will allow me next spring to get rid off a few older canes to keep the plant younger and more floriferous. Bronze Star almost every spring gets really bad canker and spring pruning leaves very few 18 inch or so ugly looking stubs. But she is a strong grower and in no time sends lots of stems and by the first flush shes already over three-foot tall ball and loaded with lots of huge flowers. I continue keeping the pleasant shape of roses every time I deadhead them, even if "deadheading" means cutting 2 feet off. Sorry for this long and probably not very clear explanation, its much easier to do or show than to describe....See Moreolder hybrid teas
Comments (37)Hi. I have purchased many older HT's. I generally get suckered in by fragrance descriptions, so most of what I have was purchased w/ fragrance in mind. I have lost some due to winter cold and others have been just very feeble and have just faded away. Aside from the Radiance clan, in Maryland's hot humid weather most get BS as often as modern roses - maybe more often. Here's what i have in no particular order ** are particular favorites for fragrance and repeat: Julia's Rose Governor Roselini ** nice sweet fragrance,amazing repeat Legendary - poor repeat, only 2 yrs old, though Heart's Desire - wonderful, very tender, died 2nd winter Radiance ** Red radiance ** Song of Paris The Doctor** Amazing color, fragrance, bloom size!!! very tender, died in winter, Must reorder! Enchantress Catalonia Clair de Lune - ** very nice fragrance and color! tender Gruss an Coberg - smells like beer to me... Papa Meilland - simply the best in every way September Morn ** Sutter's Gold - ** Ophelia Erotika ** Herzogin... My Choice Dame Edith Helen Invitation ** fragrant, very fast repeat Grace de Monaco ** a must have, super huge blooms, very fragrant, saw in Vintage Garden's garden and HAD to have. Cymbeline - not an old HT, but an old Austin that I fear will be lost - one of my favorites for color, form and fragrance, great over a short arch Sunday Lemonade ** Talisman - just faded away... lovely, though Catalonia - also faded away after a harsh winter That's all I can remember for now... : ) These are very new ones from last season's order, so I'm still evaluating: Betty Uprichard Lady Luck Mme Jules Bouche Mrs. Wakefield C.M. Tally Ho Lili Marlene - slight fragrance, but very BS resistant so far - really taking off for a new band. Mission Bells Hope this helps! feel free to email w/ any ?? Jennifer...See MoreAre Hybrid Tea bands not as vigorous?
Comments (11)Excellent question and excellent answers thus far, IMHO. I'm an "own root only" gardener. As has been stated indirectly, good growth requires good roots. The less developed a root system is to begin with, the longer it takes to establish a good one. (Some band roses are actually just newly rooted cuttings. Others have better developed root systems and which of these one receives can be a reflection of the inherent vigor, lack thereof, market demand, or the quality of the nursery, etc.). And then there's that Vigor component. Besides the perceived (or actual) faster-to-market aspect of grafting, grafting has historically been relied upon to allow otherwise weak rose plants to come to market by having the rootstock overcome the vigor issue. HTs intended for exhibitors assumed all manner of special fungicidal, pruning, and fertilization regimes to compensate for the rose's issues. And HTs for the exhibitor market dominated the market for decades as Tom Carruth explained in the article referenced in the link below. (One has to scroll down in that thread to get the article link, but the entire thread is worthwhile, IMHO). Like the image of heaven and hell, there is a vast divide between the requirements for a good bench rose and a good garden rose. Exceptions do exist, but I won't hazard naming even one. The very modern HTs with health and vigor may prove to grow as well from bands as others, like good OGRs, but their newness combined with their high demand in the 1 gallon size means we mostly don't know that yet. But I suspect it will be so. Here is a link that might be useful: Huntington member article on the decline of the rose hobby This post was edited by sandandsun on Sat, Nov 2, 13 at 11:08...See Moremelodyinz8a
9 years agojacqueline9CA
9 years agomad_gallica (z5 Eastern NY)
9 years agosmithdale
9 years agosmithdale
9 years agoroseseek
9 years agosmithdale
9 years agojacqueline9CA
9 years agomelodyinz8a
9 years agoroseseek
9 years agoingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
9 years agoharborrose_pnw
9 years agomelodyinz8a
9 years agoharborrose_pnw
9 years agoorganic_tosca
9 years ago
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