EXTREME experiment with roses under tree

11 years ago

We have a truly gigantic Scarlet Oak tree in our front garden - it is at least 5 stories tall. Anyway, I have always wanted to have Fortune's Double Yellow, but all of the spaces in the sun with a large enough structure to climb on were already taken.

One day when out bicycling with my DH, we came across a FDY growing up and over several trees in an old park - with obviously no care. It was in full bloom and breathtaking. Looking more closely at the plant, it was totally healthy. I managed to root two cuttings from it, but what to do with them?

I once saw a FDY climbing way way up a large oak tree (not as large or dense as mine, however) at Pam's. It was blooming fine.

So, I decided on an experiment. We planted both tiny rooted cuttings at the base of our Scarlet Oak, obviously in full shade. The first year, one grew another 6 inches, and the other one just sat there - I thought it would die. The next Spring the first one produced 4 tiny blooms - as if it had been a bonsai - the other one did not bloom. After mostly sitting still for 4 years, this past Spring they both started to put on height, and for the first time they both put out some blooms. Amazing. My DH got some metal fence posts and leaned them up against the tree - both roses immediately put on about 12 inches more in height.

Here is a picture showing about the bottom fourth of the oak tree, and the bed at the bottom with the roses. I will post another more close-up picture of them next. So, I have now got great hopes for the future of these roses!

The next time a newbie asks questions on here about whether or not it is possible to grow a rose close to a tree trunk in deep shade, think of these....

Jackie

Sort by:Oldest

Comments (8)

jacqueline9CA
Original Author
11 years ago
Here is a closer look at the roses - not great yet, but they started out 3 inches tall! I have high hopes for them (pun intended)!

Jackie
0
User
11 years ago
Ho, my Paul's Himalayan Musk looks absolutely identical.....I am regarding it as a triumph of hope over experience..............and since there are another 300 or so trees waiting to be clothed......it had better work.

But look how green and happy yours look.
0
Related Discussions
Why do some hardy roses tolerate extreme heat as well?
Q
Comments (4)
My experience does not at all mimic yours. I am in even a drier climate than Kim, being more inland. The climate here is mediterranean, zone 8b. I have a Cl. Crimson Glory that has been growing happily and flowering heavily in partial shade for way more than 2 decades (it was covered in flowers in December). Gertrude Jekyll is also in partial shade. No problems with vigor--it wants to be Jack and the Beanstalk--and I've seen no loss in flowering compared to the other GJ I had in full sun. Check the ratings on HMF as others have given it a good rating for shade tolerance. What works for roses in your climate may not apply to everyone else everywhere else for the same varieties. Many quite hardy roses do not demand full sun here. Not surprising as the sun in Southern California can be very intense. Alba roses in particular can be hardy in some really cold climates (a couple zones or so colder than yours) yet multiple of them are known for shade tolerance (I have 3 albas--all in part shade). Rugosas likewise. Check HMF and note rugosas hardy down to zone 2, yet you may also find multiple of them that are described as shade tolerant. Check to see how many of these are listed thru zone 10, zone 9, or even only up to zone 8. The cold tolerance does not necessarily translate to heat tolerance or the demand for full sun. My rugosa magnifica I've had for about 8 years. It has been in pretty dense shade and was still able to grow and flower. I cut back some of the underbrush and shade canopy around it last year so that it gets perhaps 3 hours of sun per day. It has more than doubled in size and blooms more. RM is listed as being hardy to zone 3 on HMF. Location, location, location! Melissa
...See More
Horrible Customer Service Experience at David Austin Roses USA
Q
Comments (42)
ut you last post is the stressed part. You or anyone can not make that assumption of who is more stressed. You do not know their life. When I had breast cancer, my garden was my outlet for stress more than any other time in my life. I wintersowed very slowly because I could hardly do it, but it gave me a sense of purpose and things to come in the spring. I dreamed through the catalogs of what to buy believing I would be there to live to see them bloom. I tended my plants best I could in spring. I'm sorry I'm getting teary eyed now. I'm sorry. I know what cancer is like. My dad had chemical based leukemia, 14% chance of survival.. he didn't. Treatment was horrible, he did a clinical trial, I have to say that what he went through in the month plus that he was doing the clinical trial, I don't know why anyone would fight that particular cancer. Back to the garden & plants. When he came out of the hospital he was greeted by plants. My hubby, son & I worked really hard to plant his vegetable garden at his new house (it closed a week after being diagnosed) plus I duplicated my gardens at his house. We'd dug up a few of his roses, plus I bought more. I even bought a daylily that was not common, which I now call Matty for him. He was speechless when he came home. We used to like to sit on his porch & watch the butterflies & hummingbirds. While he wasn't allowed near the plants due to his particular type of cancer, he could sit there and enjoy it. He wasn't allowed to eat his veggies either until he went into remission a few months later. His guardian angel gave us really warm weather until November, we were able to have his Hungarian peppers in my stuffing for Thanksgiving. Through his whole nightmare, gardening & plants brightened the time he was out of the hospital. I'm not able to buy a lot of plants any more due to my back problems. There's a reason why I haven't added many photos to helpmefind, I'm not able to walk around the garden like I used to. I do want to buy a few roses next year & will probably be buying from David Austin. Since I'll use a regular credit card, I doubt I'll have issues and so far have not had a bad experience the last time we ordered. I'd ordered a Benjamin Britten rose, it was horrible, a phone call or email with no questions asked and they replaced it.
...See More
Results of rose experiment out by street
Q
Comments (2)
It sounds like my experiments, called trial and error. It sure sounds like you've found a winner in Snowbelt. Thanks for sharing.
...See More
Rose for Extreme Heat
Q
Comments (17)
Technically, my summer temps don't reach 115 degrees often, but my rose garden is located in a heat pit that traps the heat between the slope at the back of my property and the house. It's easy to tell that it is hotter in the rose garden than at the top of the slope. It's cooler up there ... lol. My summer temps officially range from the high 90s to around 110 degrees for months, BUT (and this is important) my night temps cool off down to the low 70s, which gives the rose the opportunity to pull moisture up to the top of the plant. Reviewing the roses in the garden, I have found that the roses with thick petal substance and dense foliage do best in high temps. I also prune differently than I was taught when I started my rose life. I don't take off all of the twiggy growth as long as it can create foliage. In my experience the extra foliage helps the plant to be more heat tolerant. I also am home a lot and spray down the roses daily during the period of high heat. The plants can absorb moisture through their leaves. This practice also controls spider mites. Few rose books or websites even mention petal substance, but if you read the patents on HMF, you can often find information about the thickness of the foliage of the bloom. Smiles, Lyn
...See More
Related Professionals
Otsego Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers · Wilmington Landscape Contractors · Cockeysville Landscape Contractors · Lake Saint Louis Landscape Contractors · Parker Landscape Contractors · Plantation Landscape Contractors · Point Pleasant Landscape Contractors · Round Lake Landscape Contractors · Wareham Landscape Contractors · Charleston Swimming Pool Builders · Grandview Swimming Pool Builders · Stafford Swimming Pool Builders · Baltimore Siding & Exteriors · Johns Creek Siding & Exteriors · Saratoga Springs Siding & Exteriors
catsrose
11 years ago
I have a number of roses, including the Musk rose and Crepuscle, growing in the shade of an ancient white oak. They all to get either morning or afternoon sun, but no mid-day sun.
0
jacqueline9CA
Original Author
11 years ago
"Triumph of hope over experience" - that is exactly what it is! I look forward to hearing/seeing how your PHM does - a woods with lots of trees covered in huge roses is my idea of Paradise.

Catsrose - my oak tree is deciduous, so in the WInter the roses get more light, but still hardly any sun. I am looking forward to next Spring, to see what they do. Will try and remember to post pictures.

Jackie
0
brenda_l_w
11 years ago
Thanks for sharing Jackie. Fortune's Double Yellow is one of those roses I love but have to enjoy places other than my own yard. To see it in bloom at the Empire Mine in Grass Valley is beautiful.
0
hartwood
11 years ago
This is great! I love it when an experiment works out the way we hope.

I have 'Alexandre Girault' planted on my rambler fence between two tall spindly Black Walnut trees. During the season, when the walnut trees have leaves, this rose gets NO direct sun at all. The winter sun it gets must be enough to give it what it needs, because it blooms beautifully every year. I am planning to train it into the walnut trees and see what happens.

Sometimes it's best to experiment, instead of playing it safe and by-the-book all the time.
0
nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska
11 years ago
Ah, what a great idea - to put those loose metal stakes for the roses to climb on! I've been similarly experimenting with roses under our massive burr oak tree in the back yard. I had been wondering how to rig up a climbing mechanism around a tree whose trunk takes two people to circle it with their arms, and this looks like a good solution without being a massive structure. So far, I have a New Dawn, Secret Garden Musk Climber, Pinkie, cl., and a few others that seem to have established well in 2-3 years, and look about ready to climb. Thanks so much for the picture and the encouragement to let vision trump common sense a little!

Cynthia
0
jacqueline9CA
Original Author
11 years ago
Cynthia - yes, it was my DH's idea to use fence stakes. At the moment they are just resting against the tree. They were just put there temporarily to give the roses some way to get over to the trunk. When the roses get taller (when, not if!) we will probably put some screw eyes directly into the tree trunk and remove the fence posts - the first branches, as you can see in the first pic, are 15 feet off the ground, so it will take the roses a while to get up to where they can use those to climb on.

Jackie
0

EXTREME experiment with roses under tree

Comments (8)

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

User

Related Discussions

Related Professionals

catsrose

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

brenda_l_w

hartwood

nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

EXTREME experiment with roses under tree

Comments (8)

jacqueline9CAOriginal Author

User

Related Discussions

Related Professionals

catsrose

jacqueline9CAOriginal Author

brenda_l_w

hartwood

nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

jacqueline9CAOriginal Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

jacqueline9CA
Original Author