uh, silly putty compost? HUH? I dont think so.

Just marketing hype crap.

It looks disgusting.

Much of the information on the website is good adn should not be totally disregarded simply because the guy wants to seel you a very expensive book that tells you the same thing that is available free on the web.

Call me skeptical but curious. Not curious enough to pony up the $35 for the e-book, but curious. OTOH, the list of free bonus materials might make this not the worst deal in the world. Dunno. Try it and get back to us. ;-)

Humus is indeed (or at least can be) a colloid. But I've certainly never seen anything like THAT come out of my compost pile. The picture on the front of the book is of what looks like a big pile of straw. And I can't imagine any aerobic process producing something that looks like a brown blob of clay. So if I had to guess, I'd say maybe he developed some new process of fermenting straw anaerobically?

I Googled it and couldn't find much except a post on another forum, in which an anonymous contributer claimed that he/she had spectacular results. An anonymous poster - might have been the author himself pumping his book!

Skeptical but curious,
-Diggity

I think that or at least as close as I can come to it. Works for me.
Bill P.

I think it *was* the author - the style and wording was exactly the same. I just came here to ask "what new silliness is this?" I'm like you - I see snake oil and I want to know what it's all about. All humus has colloidal properties...but what method might he be claiming as superior and why? I found another site making more or less the same claims about "colloidal humus" that sounded like it was made by an ESL student - this one with the name "Jade Woodhouse." No silly putty, though. (http://www.simplynaturalorganic.com/book_compost.html)
I'm thinking maybe he's flogging clay.

The one I list really does seem to be sincere about normal old compost - she's just using the same phrase. And some pretty iffy copy.

I saw the website for worlds best compost and so I did a little more searching on how to make colloidal compost, and apparently it is possible and wonderful stuff. I didn't want to pony up the $$ for an E-book tho - I'd like hard copy thank you!
I checked out sooo many websites and they all seemed to lead directly back to slick sales man dude. I couldn't even find a book review. (which leads me here)
I found Jade Woodhouse's web site also, she had alot of neat stuff to say about permaculture too, so I emailed her to order her book on composting and on raising chikens. She emailed me back to say she would not sell/send me her books because she felt the information was only relevant to Austrailia. (I live in Canada) WTF???
I guess the rest of the world does not deserve the worlds best compost!! I did find this
www.squidoo.com/how-to-make-compost
but it could be the author touting himself again, I wonder if there is more to it than that??
I'll be trying it in the spring. I'll keep ya posted.

I found this one.

Here is a link that might be useful: Better than compost

And this one.

Biodynamic composting. It also refers to a putty-like result.

Here is a link that might be useful: Bio-dynamic farming

Thanks hamiltongardener, that first link had some useful info and explained it in plainer terms than I have read elsewhere. I wonder why everyone wan't to get rich off the knowledge of how to make it.
This link roughly tells you how to make it, but I'm still very curious... I may yet cave in and order the ebook.

Here is a link that might be useful: how to make compost

I'm curious too but not enough to risk money.

the above article seems to give the usual conventional advice on compost making.
The only think kind of difference is covering it with straw.

Swanz, that was my conclusion as well I can't figure out what the difference is. I'm not buying the book but I'd sure like to know the secret if there is one.

Mary thanks to you I'm spending all day goggling colloidal humus:).

I spent several days googling it also...

I have been reading quite a bit about soil improvement for the last few months. Please don't ask for sources, because I probably don't remember (I have ADD and tend to retain only what I want to retain, which is a PITA most times).

If you put these little bits of info together, it sort of sounds like the basis for this guy's book:

1. Soil colloids are the smallest particles in soil, and are composed of clay and humus particles. They are the chemically-active part of soil.

2. Most soils carry a negative charge, except for soils with a very low pH. The negative charges are found on the surface of soil colloidal particles.

3. People who study compost are saying that when you make your compost pile, add some clay to it. You can even go to a potter's supply and buy a bag of plain old dry terra cotta clay (etc), and add it to your compost, if you are seriously lacking in clay (as I am). Or go visit a friend who curses his clay soil and get a couple of bucketsful.

4. A couple of years ago, I read a snippet about a guy by the name of Philip S. Callahan, Ph.D, who was talking about paramagnetism in farming. This sounded like witchcraft/BS, so I skipped it. Then I read about these low-frequencies in the soil, and wonder if maybe he doesn't have something there, and maybe I misunderstood. His book is "Paramagnetism- Rediscovering Nature's Secret Force of Growth".

5. Also, I am reading about Terra Preta, the Black Earth of the Amazon, Charcoal Agriculture. Here are tremendously productive soils that have been planted for hundreds of years, surrounded by highly acidic, low-organic material rainforest, that seems to reproduce itself. Scientists are studying it, but it seems to have something to do with all the burned weeds and waste they turned back into the soil over the years.

So, suppose someone wrote a book about adding clay and charcoal to the compost, affecting the magnetic charges to the point where the soil was extremely attractive to plants?

By the way, if you ever come up with something to sell online, you would be better off not using the format of the current crop of snake-oil salesmen.

Sue

I know Elliot Coleman added clay to his compost which helped in his sandy soil.

And here we are, yet another person who's curious about this...

I don't suppose someone here wants to go halfsies on the price or something? lol

Here is my major problem with his ad...

It appears to be in the same format as a 1000 other online advertisements, making alot of bold claims. It really doesnt matter if he turns off poeple, he knows someone will pay for his ebook. It could be a finance company claiming to make you rich, a real eastate mogul with "use my formula and you will be rich" BLAH BLAH BLAH...

Im not saying what he is selling doesnt have truth in it, what im saying is most of these guys take some knowledge, make it look really fancy then try to make money off from it.

I really doubt his "Worlds Best Compost" would actually delivery enough of this colloid, using his method to make that much difference between his method and the usual composting method.

I dont mean to sound to harsh, but in reality what alot of these companies prey on, are people who can ill afford to buy into any of these "scams".

Just a little ticked off today I guess! Too MUCH SNOW AND ICE!

Silverkelt

Silverkelt,

My overall feeling is the same. He MAY have come across some kind of formula that works, but like kimmsr said above, it's probably a collection of the same info that you can find on the web.

That's an awful lot of money for a DOWNLOAD.

Oh, and his photo reminded me of #6 of the information I have come across....

#6. COVER your compost. In high-precipitation areas, it will prevent a lot of the nutrients from being washed away. In dry areas, it will help to prevent needed moisture from escaping.

Sue

Yep Silverkelt, I agree 100%. I have very sandy soil and am curious about that
play-doh like compost, but I'm sure he won't offer anything we ain't already
heard.

I'd just like to know if this would be better for my potted plants... lol

though, right now, the soil I have them in is horrible >_>;; but it's all I had...

I had stumbled upon "The World's Best Compost"... while browsing compostumber(s)... Just had to read the diatribe ... And,, I won't fork out the money for something so Wonderful aka,,, hyper-hype-claims... It does touch of some curiosity - I've never read anything about collodial humus........ If it was so Great,, surely by now the Home Depots and Lowes' stores would be keeping the stuff on thier shelves,, no? ...Right... why wouldn't they?? oh,, okay,, if it works so great, it'd put commercial fertilizer companies out of business??? I don't have all the answers, but Part of the joy (( and sweet misery )) with working in MY yard is the challenge it poses to make the green growth happen! I live in Florida - very sandy soil.. awfully challenging- especially on the east side of the house... the weeds proliferate and the grass suffers.. Just ain't right! Well,, I planted a row of crepe myrtles -= they may provide added shade .. I swear it could also be the used oil we all used to dump on the side of the house back in the 1970s... OOPS!! yes,, I am paying for that now - the long arm of the law will catch ya!! Anywho... keep to basics is what I keep thinking: plants need sunlight, water and food.. PERIOD!! oh yes,, in fine print:: ** in the right measure **... Git er done!! keep a smile warming too :)

Excuse me for butting in:

There's an article on the web by someone who evidently bought the ebook at:

http://www.squidoo.com/how-to-make-compost

The person who wrote it seems to be sold. I'm still at a loss as to how to use such a solid looking clay-like substance but then I've only just decided to go organic--as opposed to using nothing as I have been doing.

Bullsigh

Here is a link that might be useful: http://www.squidoo.com/how-to-make-compost

Thanks. Mxbarbie posted that same link above. Nothing in that article to account for the
clay like properties.

It seems that this guy is pushing the "biodynamic methods"
The guy he menttions in the web site Alex Podolinsky, is a big Bd guy, google him with compost and ye'll see it. I have talked to several people who have worked with Bd preps and such and they say there is really something to it. Check out link for a detailed analysis of bd compost. What is a ashame is that the founder of Bd- rudolph steiner- wanted to make the BD way affordable- the preps are indeed. But you still have good old fashioned greed - with guys pushing the worlds greatest compost.

Here is a link that might be useful: real data on bd compost

OK, I bought the e-book (I'm a risk taker, some call me a sucker) and I have two piles going. It was fairly easy to do with the second pile going much easier than the first. I think you may be able to piece the method together by sifting through Podolinsky's work but it was nice to have everything right in one spot along with helpful tips. IF I get the "colloidal humus" out of it then I think it would have been worth it. We will see. I didnt pay much attention to the biodynamics part this time around but I might with the next heap. I wont know how successful I've been until the end of July. I will update then.

Since regular compost is so fabulous, I don't see why there would be such desire to make play-doh like compost. Sounds unpleasant to me, what I like about compost is how fluffy it is compared to my heavy clay soil. And I tend to put some clay soil into my compost piles, and have never observed any strange results. I just do that to add compost critters from my soil.

Marcia

O.K. I saw the compost ad also when I was looking on the web for info on buying compost. I am a new gardener and need to buy compost as I don't have a compost bin or anything. I know....you all have been gardening for years and are grinning at my question. :) Who better to ask than you? Just tell me what to buy at Lowes or someplace. (I am planting roses)

I would recommend that you NOT purchase compost or any gardening supplies at a "big box" place (Home Depot, Lowes, WalMart, etc.) and that you seek out a local, independent nursery/garden supply store.

You may need to pay a little more for your stuff, but you will receive INCREDIBLE advice from the experienced people who work at the independent place.

Re. purchased compost in general: make sure that you get a variety of "sources." Not all from steer manure or chicken manure, for example. Get different kinds to mix together for your plants. This helps the plants get a wider variety of nutrients.

Start to make your own compost as soon as you can, too. It will be wonderful for your plants and will help reduce your garbage bills (if your service is like ours and bills by the size of garbage can). You can compost kitchen waste, fallen leaves, many kinds of yard/plant clippings, etc. Making compost is a large topic unto itself, but the actual process doesn't need to be complicated or cost very much, either.

One way to get a low-cost compost bin is to check with your local city/county government to see whether they have a subsidized bin purchasing system. It's to their advantage for residents to compost, as well, b/c in many areas of the US, municipalities are running out of landfill room, so diverting the waste stream is good for the local gov't and for us!

Happy gardening.

Cynthia H.

asak9,

If you bought the book, mind telling us (at least roughly) how he winds up with a lump of putty from the composting process?

Humus colloids are organic matter that has been broken down so finely that it can't get any smaller.

Soil colloids are particles of clay that can't be broken down any smaller than they are.

Both humus and clay colloids are both the size of dust, and they both hold nutrients. But since they are so fine, they are the first to blow away in the wind, and the first to wash away in rain or irrigation.

Since my soil is sandy, I am adding non-clumping cat litter to my soil so it will contain some clay. Most clay cat litters are composed mainly of bentonite clay.

Sue

Thanks for the info, Cynthia! I will be off to my local nusery tomarrow to buy what they recommend for compost. I was glad for the composter advice too, as I had visited the local hardware store to look at composters....knew I would have to put some research into it. I will check with the city, etc. Thanks for helping a novice! Carol

Swanz: "I know Elliot Coleman added clay to his compost which helped in his sandy soil.".

I had forgotten this until yesterday when I started rereading book "The New Organic Grower".

He uses montmorillonite (also sold as Wyoming bentonite) in compost made from hay of various forage crops.

Coleman: " Montmorillonite is an expanding lattice clay that has been determined to have both biotic and abiotic effects in aiding the conversion of organic matter into stable humus. The resulting clay humus fraction that develops is very beneficial to soil fertility and plant growth".

In his greenhouse he also spreads this clay directly to the soil. "Montmorillonite has the highest cation exchange capacity of all mineral soil components." He also mentions that it plays a role in the reduction of plant disease.

asak9
Ok you bought this book would this compost work for people who have clay dirt already? ofsthun111@myway.com

thanks, Judie

queuetue,

The putty comes from stopping the process at the right time. The book says about 7/8ths done, any longer and you just have good soil. Im not at that point yet so I cant tell you anything from experience.

I dug into the first pile to see what was going on. Its been about two months now and I was impressed by how far along things are. Parts of the pile dried out some so it may take longer to finish. I added water. LOTS of worms! The second pile looks to be right on schedule with pictures he had in the book.

One advantage to this method is you don't have to turn it, once you make your pile you are done (except for checking the moisture). I have a regular pile that I put kitchen scraps into (I dont turn this pile either) and also a tumbler that was given to me. The book says the tumbler stuff is basicly mulch compared to the colloid compost.

juteamup,

Yes, in fact in the book he used that as an example, amending poor clay soil into very good soil.

Reading through my posts I sound like I'm trying to sell this book but I'm just relaying what I've read. I don't have any colloid humus yet so the jury is still out. I do like the results so far. I'll try to take some pictures later and see if I can post them.

asak9,

How did your biodynamic compost piles work out? Did you end up with humus like the Rod described? I got the book too. When he explained how plants feed and take in water, that really got my attention. It blew me away and I understand now why we have so many problems with pest and diseases. I've been an organic gardener for many years and knew there had to be a better way to create healthier plants.

Did you use the preparations technique? I was hoping to hear from someone who was successful without the preparations before I started my first pile.

Anxious to hear your results.

I have nothing but clay, if anyone wants to ship me a truckload of their sandy garden soil I'll fill the truck with clay and send it back. :-]

Those of you adding clay to your sand, beware the Concrete Effect. If you get just enough binder (clay) in your aggregate (sand), look out.

BTW I don't know how plants could really use a lump of putty. IMHO the soil microbes MAKE the colloidal humics in place, distributed throughout the soil, and that's what you want. No way tiny plant roots could access such a lump. It has to be finely divided, more than tools or machines can do. The micro herd does it for you.

I bought the book. Still not sold on this stuff but I guess I'll give it a try and see what happens.

It's not adding clay, although I think this method depends greatly on the use of straw.

There are things about this that still don't make sense to me and I've read through it twice. First, he says that this type of compost improves the soil for many, many years to come. Then in a different part of the materials he says that if it is allowed to dry out than it's pretty much game over. So which is it? Don't tell me that this stuff can be mixed in the soil and then years later still be great.. and that it never ever dried out during all those years.

So, the jury is out on this one. I also don't like the fact that the author pretty much claims that everything we make in our piles, bins and tumblers is pretty much worthless to plants. Try telling my plants that!

I have hard clay soil in areas that haven't already been worked with a lot over the years. I bought this out of curiosity, and I'm still curious. I don't know guys.. but for now I'd say the world's best compost truly is the stuff we make ourselves.

I'll preface this by saying that I haven't read the book, nor do I plan to at this time. I did quite a bit of googling about colloidal compost, and everything traced back to a not-so-hidden advertisement placed by the author himself.

I find it most telling that I didn't find any university information about it, and he even says (IIRC) that all other compost experts have ignored colloid compost. Where are the university studies? With all the universities devoting time and resources to studying and perfecting the composting process, wouldn't they have something on this superior compost product? I think the absence of backing information says something.

asak9, did it work?

Well, it's to bad asak9 hasn't responded yet with their results. Gnomey is right, you are not adding clay, it's a matter of how you build your compost pile, temperature & moisture control, and timing. And no, the ball of clay looking stuff he has on his site is not what it looks like when you use it. He is just showing what the consistancy is like when who clump it up into a ball showing you the colloidal effect. Liking it to jello. A liquid in a solid state. He's been very helpful so far.

I'm going to create my pile this spring and see how it works out. When you buy the book, Rod let's you email him with any questions you need to ask. I will ask him the part about drying out, because I'm curious too. He's been very helpful so far.

After doing some more research on humus it's very interesteing. It's my understanding that humus isn't fully understood and very difficult to explain. Just to help understand I've broken it down a bit.

Humus by deffinision from Websters is " a brown or black complex variable material resulting from partial decomposition of plant or animal matter and forming the organic portion of soil" comes from "New Latin, from Latin, earth"

From Wikipedia is close to the same deffinition "Humus (Latin - "soil ") is the organic material in soil lending it a dark brown or black colouration"

And the deffinition for Colloid from Websters is "2 a: a substance that consists of particles dispersed throughout another substance which are too small for resolution with an ordinary light microscope but are incapable of passing through a semipermeable membrane b: a mixture consisting of a colloid together with the medium in which it is dispersed"

And from Wikipedia "A colloid is a type of mechanical mixture where one substance is dispersed evenly throughout another." " A colloidal system may be solid, liquid, or gaseous"

Aparently if you can let any organic matter decompose basicly with out any dirt it will form a jelly like substance once fully decomposed and in a stable condition. Depending on how well you create humus you could actually end up with nothing. If your humus becomes so stable that it will not provide any help to your plants.

I would say this guy just did some research and took what nature already does and is just trying to sell it. I would like to see him actually product this. He may have theroy behind it but no experiance or ability to actually produce this.

Take a look at Wikipedia I think they do a very good job explain humus.

As far as our own compost. Well keep it cook'n we are still breaking down organic matter into stuff that helps our soils and plants and will eventually allow mother nature to create her own humus.

Here is a link that might be useful: Wikipedia Humus

Well, it's to bad asak9 hasn't responded yet with their results. Gnomey is right, you are not adding clay, it's a matter of how you build your compost pile, temperature & moisture control, and timing. And no, the ball of clay looking stuff he has on his site is not what it looks like when you use it. He is just showing what the consistancy is like when who clump it up into a ball showing you the colloidal effect. Liking it to jello. A liquid in a solid state. He's been very helpful so far.

I'm going to create my pile this spring and see how it works out. When you buy the book, Rod let's you email him with any questions you need to ask. I will ask him the part about drying out, because I'm curious too. He's been very helpful so far.

Ok, here's an update. Its not done yet. The shortest time to finish it is 3 months. Mine is taking longer, being my first try I made a few mistakes. I let it dry out too much. I'm using alot of buttonwood leaves that take longer than most to decompose and I didnt chop them up. I also let some roots grow into the bottom which sucked up some stuff (should have isolated pile with small trench). Even with all that, right now I have really good compost, so at least it wasn't a waste of time. I will let it go another month and dig back in, I'm thinking that should do it. I moved the pile to get the roots out of there and noticed in parts what looked like colloidal humus.

I built another pile yesterday, using the method in the ebook.

Thanks for the update asak9! Did you insert any of the preparations he said to use?

asak9 would you send me the recipe???
rbell20022002@yahoo.com

pappabell,
the recipe is on
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/soil/msg0119493010777.html?12
Posted by blutranes z8 Ga (My Page) on Tue, Jan 6, 09 at 10:46
Very interesting and I am going to try it (in a small way)
Otis

Help, I put a ball of untreated wool on top of my compost and the color turn to red/orange in like 3 days. why was it? is it caused by dangerous bacteria? why the wool get the same red/brown color as the compost?