No offense taken. When I think of shrubs on the small size, the barberry, spirea, and potentilla are the first things I think of since the varieties mentioned above have been effective for me. We tend to get snow early and it stays late so I've never seen any of them in a leafless state - they're virtually in full leaf when the snow goes. :-)

I picked the Dart's Gold ninebarks because I needed something in a different color green to stand out a bit in a particular spot; the wine shades might disappear for me. Stretched out, I've probably got some 6' branches - but high arching and not hitting the ground. I think if we had longer runs of really sunny days, they'd be a bit more "chartreus-y" than they are now.

That clethra looks great! Bookmarked.

I've tried, and killed several paniculata hydrangeas here. It's not the cold hardiness, I don't think, but perhaps the aridity? Or the alkaline soil? I don't see them in anyone else's yard either. The only hydrangea I see around here are Annabelles with their poor, heavy flowers drooping down in the dirt. I'll pass.

I don't grow the 'Fairy' rose (not quite hardy here) but I have a similar one called 'Madison' that is an astonishingly great rose that I can no longer find anywhere. I would buy them by the dozen if I could find them! Anyway, I have it at the front of a bed with nearby 'Happy Returns' daylilies and 'Johnson's Blue' geranium.

Duluth, thanks for the report on Dart's Gold. Sounds pretty big, but I have a lot of space to take up so I might try it. Do you have a picture of them?

Good point that we don't see the shrubs in winter since they are snow-covered. I probably need to broaden my mind more on those. Although I do have my eye on a juniper (Daub's Frosted), of all things! It will be an interesting transition for the gardens, I'm kinda psyched for it!

I've been planting xeric shrubs, but I live in the high Southwestern desert, z7 with occasional z6 winters. Of the shrubs I have, only golden current (ribes aureum) is hardy to z4. See link below. Mine is a couple of months old, still compact, with glossy scalloped deep green leaves. I've seen this growing in other gardens, and it is handsome all year round.

My other shrubs include curl leaf mahogany, fern bush, buddleia weyeriana, three-leaf sumac, manzanita, vitex and desert willow. I don't think any of these will survive a z4 winter.

Cheryl

Here is a link that might be useful: ribes aureum

I'm interested in the Miniature Snowflake too... Most of the shrubs I'm trying are listed as hardy to zone 5, so might not work for you. They include:

- Fothergilla gardenii - which is a smaller species than the usual fothergillas you see. I have this in the backyard but got the bigger 'Mount Airy' to try in the front as I'd like to get a bigger show of fall color there. The jury is still out on Mount Airy as it hasn't been happy - I think the winter might have been too tough on it!

- Exochorda 'The Bride' and 'Snow Day Surprise' - some places list these as hardy to zone 4, but they flower at the end of May and have large buds (the 'pearls' of the pearlbush common name...) so would likely be very vulnerable to frost damage in a colder zone. My 'The Bride' is a few years old now and I've kept it to a single stem and have it staked to try to make it into a sort of weeping small tree! It's very cute in spring :-) Somebody gave me Snow Day Surprise, which is supposed to be a smaller plant - but I think what they gave me might have been a small tissue-culture (?) start as it is still VERY small several years later and has never bloomed. I'm afraid I'm going to forget what it is and yank it as a weed of some sort! My 'The Bride':
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- 'Little Henry' Itea - I've tried this several times in different places. It has been short-lived for me - gets winterkilled easily but I keep trying because I like them.

- 'Little Tuff Stuff' hydrangea - I planted this late last summer. It made it through the winter and has flowerbuds now. They aren't kidding about it being little! It's lost under/behind a single peony at the moment and will need to be moved next spring if I'm happy with its flowering.

- Angel roses - these are seed-grown Rosa chinensis minima. It's hard to find a source of the seeds now (I have lots!) Because they are seed-grown species roses, you can't predict what you'll get, but all are cute, tough things in a range of colors from white to deep pinks, some single/some double, some scented/some not. They start off small but get true canes after a couple of years. Mine form a thicket/hedge 30-36" tall. In spring they get whacked down to 12-18". After the flowers fade, they get tiny bright red hips that are very showy and stay on the plant all winter. The robins go nuts over them in the spring! It's hard to get a good picture of them at the moment as the row of pea pots on the driveway are in front of them. You can see double pink ones and double white ones on the left side; the ones on the right were/are mostly singles that are finished blooming and starting to form the hips. There is a clematis (? Prince Charles?) scrambling over them. The OSO Easy roses look somewhat like the Angel roses and they are listed as very hardy (although my Paprika did fine this winter, Peachy Cream is barely hanging on) so you could try those too.
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- I have the 'Palibin' Korean lilac and really like it. I was reading a book a year or so ago by a designer in NY (whose name I can't remember....) She was talking about using them in her garden, saying they can be grown and pruned as a hedge to substitute for boxwood! After reading that I now deadhead the shrubs by just taking shears to them and whacking off the messy bits in large chunks. I leave the shrub in its natural shape but don't worry about fussy deadheading to tidy it up after the flowers brown out.

Lovely 'Bride' Woody and Cheryl, I do like that currant - they are tough customers.

But don't feel like you need to limit your suggestions to my zone - since lots of us seem to be interested in shrubifying our perennial beds these days, bring on the suggestions from all points!

Interesting thread, because I have been TRYING to do the same thing for a couple of years. I put in a spirea, a rhododendron Percy Weisman, Hydrangea Pia, physocarpus with red foliage, variegated camellia, a yellow leaved corylopsis, and oakleaf hydrangea...I still think I want more evergreens so that it holds the border together and looks more interesting in winter.

My preferred plantings are designed to deal with the arid West. I also need to have plants which can take the high heat and intense sunlight in New Mexico. So no hydrangeas or azaleas. I took out roses which were frying in the midsummer heat. Everything in our garden is very new, most planted this year so I'm not showing pictures of them yet. I'm linking to sites which give information and show pictures.

These are the shrubs I like best: First is manzanito panchito. According to the website below it is hardy to Z4b so may survive in Karin's area.
http://plantselect.org/2008/01/panchito-manzanita-a-native-not-to-miss/

I planted one about 6 weeks ago but it may have died due to overwatering by my zealous DH. It is very prone to root rot and diseases if it's too wet. I'm hoping it comes back from the dead. I ran out and bought a second because I want this so badly.

Next is fernbush (chamaebatiara millefolium), aka desert sweet:
http://www.laspilitas.com/nature-of-california/plants/chamaebatiaria-millefolium

We planted two of these at the same time as the manzanita. These have settled down and are showing growth. I've seen these in several local gardens, they look full and deep green even in our desert climate. They are sweetly fragrant. And deer and rabbits ignore them! That's a big plus for me.

Next is buddleia weyeriana X Honeycomb: http://www.perennials.com/plants/buddleia-weyeriana-honeycomb.html

This is a BIG buddleia, supposedly reaching 8' tall x 5' wide. We just planted this yesterday. I saw it on a garden tour and it was love at first sight. It's a stately shrub, tall and wide with attractive rounded shape. The flowers are distinctive, honey gold in little pom poms along the stalks. We have it at the back of a deep border, surrounded by tough native salvias.

Three-leaf sumac (rhus trilobata): http://www.laspilitas.com/nature-of-california/plants/rhus-trilobata

This is another NM native so can take the climate. I have this planted in a wild part of our property. The shape of the shrub is neat, I like the leaf shape, it has interest almost year round and the berries appeal to birds.

Mountain mahogany: http://www.laspilitas.com/nature-of-california/plants/cercocarpus-ledifolius

Our mahogany is actually a cross between cercocarpus ledifolius and c. intricatus (http://plantselect.org/2009/04/little-leaves-little-work-curlleaf-mtn-mahogany/). Karin, littleleaf m. mahogany might work for you. The plants I've seen remind me of conifers, and these are as tough as they come. All the mahoganies produce seeds with curled tails like apache plume, very pretty after the flowers are gone.

The other shrubs we have are probably too big for most gardens, but I'd be happy to give more details for anyone interested. We have vitex, desert willow and New Mexican privet planted to grow as small trees. Typically these grow to 10-15' in this area.

Cheryl

Cotinus 'Golden Spirit' and 'Royal 'Purple' are two that I enjoy for their colorful foliage and decent-sized leaves. I cut them back to keep their size in check.

Way back at the start of my gardening days, I considered shrubs a nifty and easy way to cheaply fill a space with blooms while retaining structure....and naturally over egged the pudding (lavatera!). Then the rose craze took hold and all remaining sanity vanished. Fortunately, a chance to lease my allotments saved us from disappearing forever underneath layers upon layers of foliage (because naturally, I wanted huge roses). Although a few crazes remained (deutzias and philadelphus), shrubs were largely banished until recently when they have been creeping back into favour.....not least because I have a bloody great blank ex-bramble infested wilderness to fill.........so, back to the drawing boards with shrubby honeysuckles, both winter blooming and the rather underused L.tartarica Hack's Red, various escallonias (great evergreen presence) and, I think it is fair to say, the once despised hydrangeas definitely have a place in the woods. Apart from the common viburnum opulus, these unruly and woody beasties are not likely to find a home....nor are the acid-loving shrubs of my youth - rhodies and azaleas....although I feel a deep gloom that my sandily alkaline soil means I cannot have enkianthus, zenobia, stewartia, kalmia fothergilla and my current favourite, the fabulous disanthus cercidifolius....not to mention blueberries. Verticillium did for the redbuds and cotinus but I have been investigating saskatoons, various ribes (aureum) and other edible fruits.
Talking of common, I had to suppress a smirk after planting the ever-reliable hypericum and even (shudder) have been re-evaluating buddlejas (a horrid weedy disaster in these parts).....but on the edges of the woods, stooled hard, I see a definite role....and there is always the silvery-leaved and elegant B.lindleyana. I have a love-hate thing with the legumes, losing cytisus to broom gall mite (without a second of grief) but absolutely loving the indigoferas.

And yep, there are the roses.....although I am horribly picky here with a huge emphasis on species and giant ramblers - afraid to say that a red hybrid tea such as Mr.Lincoln or Oklahoma is never going to be planted here.....although I will happily grow Scharlachglut (very red) and my all-time favourite - R.moyessi. Then there are the tiny burnets/spinossissimas, the bizarre hulthemias, the flailing, scrambling ayreshires and, my most lovely and eagerly awaited early asian yellows (Primula, Cantabridgiensis, hugonis,......and on.....and on.

So yep, shrubs are making a come-back after years of scathing mockery (yet more humble pie).

Well, if you like evergreen stuff, I really like my Paxistima canbyi. It usually stays under 12 inches tall and spreads very slowly outward, so you can allow it to grow as large as you want or keep it smaller by chopping it off. The stems and leaves are very soft and pliable. I step on mine on a daily basis to get at my birdbath and it bounces right back.

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My Amelanchier stolonifera is about 20 years old and has stayed at about 4 feet tall with a 6 foot canopy spread. I did a bit of selective pruning on it when it was young, so now it almost resembles a small tree. I rarely prune it now. This would make a nice specimen in the right bed.

In spring it's covered with small, greenish white flowers which give way to lots and lots of edible berries right now. The birds go crazy for them. The foliage turns a brilliant orange - gold in fall.

It's kind of hard to see the shrub in this photo because of the surrounding greenery, but you should get the idea.

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You also might want to check out some of the dwarf Forsythias. There is at least one ground cover type and others that stay under 3 feet tall. I bought Show Off Surgar Baby last year and it bloomed its little stems off this spring. Here it is at only 7 inches tall.

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I think these should do OK in zone 4 especially if you have snowcover.

Kevin

Oh, choice little amelanchier. Kevin. For a long while, I only really came across A.lamarckii or the occasional canadensis....but suddenly, we can get our hands on more of them....and I hope to do so. The shrubby potential is almost scary....and I feel I am right back in novice-land (with all the insanity that entailed)....just as I am finally getting a bit more zen-like (ahem) and realistic (cough).

I am LOVING this thread - thank you Karin, for starting it. Always looking for shrub ideas, especially now that I'm downsizing the perennials.

Kevin, very nice amelanchier. Do you have a problem with suckering?

Dee

Don't forget our native beautyberry--Callicarpa americana, or at least I like it in the border....

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:253274}}

There's always Alpine Currant (Ribes Alpinum). Have a little hedge of that running along the portico. Despite the websites, the fall color is somewhat disappointing methinks - has red berries, but the foliage tends toward Gulden's spicy Brown Mustard color.

Nice Amelanchier, Kevin! I started out wanting to add a lot of natives and bought two Amelanchiers. Unfortunately we have winter moths here on the mature Maples and usually have them on the Japanese Maple too. They drop off the trees onto the shrubs below and they evidently love Amelanchiers. After four seasons of stripping the foliage, they had to be removed.

I would love to grow currants, but they are a host for white pine blister rust and neighbors on both sides have white pines.

Thanks all.

Because my garden is so small, this little guy is the only semi-tree-thing I have. It works well for me.

Dee - no suckering at all - ever.

I forgot to say, I have such a good time watching the birds interact with this shrub. Once they see the berries starting to turn red, they check them out everyday, but don't eat them until they turn purple. The Robins especially will hop from branch to branch to branch turning their heads looking at each cluster of fruit. Occasionally they will find a ripe one and wolf it down. When the majority of the berries finally turn, the Robins and Cedar Waxwings will descend in droves and pick the bush clean within a couple of days.

Kevin

I'm glad Campanula mentioned deutzia. There are so many great choices with this shrub.

Karin, I have many, many viburnums, and with some choice pruning they can be limbed up to nice tree-form shrubs. With the flowers, berries and fall foliage, my garden will never be without them. Please give them another look! Maybe you'll change your mind and try one!

Physocarpus is a great choice with such a range of options now now. I have a standard summer wine that I'm really enjoying with catmint below it. Got rid of all my darts gold. Got too gangly and huge. I couldn't seem to get this one under control with pruning and I can have a pretty heavy hand when it comes to pruning.

So many caryopteris to choose from, and with later bloom the insects are happy.

Karin, I'm curious why you won't do barberry. If they were still available here (on invasive list) I'd plant more. The smaller ones are really nice, and there are columnar choices that I wish I had. The color stays great all season and makes a nice foil to other plants.

I'm not sure why 'Ogon' spirea is not more readily available. Nice yellow, early blooming white, but not the flat-topped flowers and has a nice waterfall form. Color stays yellow all season. Speaking of yellow, 'Sun King' aralia has been great in my garden. Getting bigger each year.

I like dwarf Alberta spruce as an evergreen. Mainly because deer don't bother it and it stays fairly small.

Clethra, Itea and fothergilla are all nice options.

One really underused shrub ( at least around here) is dwarf flowering almond. Gorgeous pink flowers in spring.

I picked up a dwarf pyracantha that I have really been enjoying. I can't remember the exact name if it, but the berries can be seen from VERY far away.

Also have some dwarf sumac that doesn't sucker and gets wonderful fall color.

Hollies are a great choice that I don't think anyone mentioned yet. Deer eat my evergreen ones, but I do like winterberry which has the nice berries when there's not much going on I the garden.

I have tried various evergreens but between deer and harsh winters I'm nearly giving up on them. Covered by snow most winters anyway. I do like the gold thread cypress. Again, I'm heavy handed with the pruners so I keep many shrubs in check with once a year pruning about this time. I prune weigela into standards in some areas of my yard.

Rose of Sharon is a good shrub with many varieties available. Also like hardy hibiscus. Although slow to wake up, can't beat those huge flowers!

So many varieties of hydrangea to choose from. I'm partial to oakleaf which really survive winter well. The dwarf varieties are great. My deer keep them quite dwarf!

Would love to try more deciduous azaleas, but so would the deer!

Leochothoe is a nice shrub, also underused around here. Great copper leaf color in early spring, rich dark green in summer and burgundy in fall. Plus white flowers.

Kalmia and pieris are good choices too. I also prune pieris into tree form. Also if those get a bit too unruly and big can generally be whacked back all the way and they'll sprout anew.

Calycanthus 'Hartlage Wine' could be one of my favorite things in my garden. Have also pruned that into a small tree.

Ok, I'll stop! I love shrubs and small trees as the anchors to the garden. I have a slope that is mainly shrubs with a smattering of easy perennials including a single peony which doesn't require staking. I have a cottage garden that requires a bit more work, and many garden areas already, so when we were installing many more beds in our backyard, I knew I wanted less maintenance, but had to have the interest. Small trees and shrubs were the first things to go in and then I thought about perennials. It has been wonderful. With a good layer of mulch and a once yearly pruning it has been most rewarding without killng myself with maintenance.

Part of the backyard with small trees, shrubs and perennials.

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Mixed shrub slope. Long blooming fairy roses follow.

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-Karin, I have most of the plants you mentioned at the nursery I work at ;-) A lot of them I have used in clients gardens or have observed on other established properties.

What honeysuckle shrub are you talking about? An actual Lonicera, or Diervilla lonicera? The shrub Lonicera typically gets huge. My plants once got to about 15 feet. Diervilla is a great compact guy though. They can sucker, but not rampantly.

Just planted a 'Foxi Pavement' rose for a client of mine. The whole series smells phenomenal!

The landscapers use a lot of 'Little Devil'. Nice upright shrub. Make sure not to plant near a sprinkler- mildew can be an issue.

'Kelsey' is a dwarf shrub dogwood- same great stem color.

You might try 'Black Tower' sambucus. Narrow and upright and more vigorous.

'Bloomerang' is a dwarf lilac that tends to have some re-bloom.
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I've been considering adding more shrubs too, as there were a number of perennials that died out on me over last winter.

I snagged a wonderful dwarf 'Mariken' Ginkgo this spring, which is hardy to z3! Also got a couple of unique plants from Iseli Nurseries "mini conifer collection". A 'Whipcord' Arborvitae and Hinoki 'Chirimen'. I will undoubtedly be adding in more specimen conifers at some point too.

I've had 'Little Gem' Spruce for years and love it. Very compact.

Have you thought about Hemlock for the more shaded areas? Wonderful cultivars available...some nice and compact like 'Gentsch White'.

Broom...if you need to cover a good portion of ground. 'Gold Flash' is hardy for you. Not sure about 'Lydia'...
CMK

-Susan, great pic by the way!
CMK

Such amazing recommendations and inspiration here, wow! Just what I'd expect from this group - and thank you all for sharing what works for you.

Duluth, I'll second the recommendation of alpine currant. I also have a little hedge of them and they are real troopers.

Susan, your hillside is a great inspiration pic for me - that is the exact direction I'm moving in. You've pulled that off beautifully!

For my yard (and I'm trying not to make this all about my yard!) I agree about viburnums, I love them too but I was worried that they're too big, but I will keep them on the short list. Good point. Barberry, yeah the invasive problem and plus, have you noticed how dang thorny they are?

CMK, the honeysuckle is Lonicera periclymenum 'Honeybush' and I linked it below. After I bought my original three I have never seen them anywhere.

I do like hemlock but I don't think they do well here. But I'll have to look into that more. But that 'Black Tower' sambucus sounds excellent.

Kevin, your amelanchier stolonifera is darling! I would love to find something like that. Unfortunately deer eat our amelanchier which some can tolerate and some can't. One of mine get smaller every year and it was so pretty when I got it, sigh. But yes, the robins and waxwings are all over those plants, which is so enjoyable to watch.

Just tons of great ideas here - thanks all!

Here is a link that might be useful: Honeybush honeysuckle

Some of these are new to me and still under review but, taking my cue from what flourishes in my wood (brambles), I have a few experimental rubus shrubs on the go. Have grown a couple before which were beautiful but scarily vigorous - the graceful silver ghost. R.thibetanus...and a rampant r.cockburnianus....but am now trying edible cloudberries (r.chamaemorus), salmonberries (r.spectabilis) and most attractively, nepalese blackberries, r.napaulensis.....quite a few of which are lovely as ornamentals as well as having fruit and providing terrific cover in a wild(ish) garden.
There are a couple of osmanthus I have coming along which seem promising - o.fragrans and o.delavayii and, as I do a bit of basketry, I will have a range of osier willows, particularly the purple salix daphnoides and scarlet s.alba Britzensis...and not forgetting the coloured dogwoods such as cornus sanguinea and c.kesselringii.

This is a wonderful thread. Thank you Karin for starting it. As we are in our 60's now, DH and I are starting to plan for less work in the landscaping and beds in the future. While we want to do it, the body just says "No!." We had landscaping installed about 5 years ago along with a front walkway installed with pavers. Every year, we've removed a shrub or two that they put in because it got too large for the space and one died this past winter. Don't know why the landscapers refuse to put in smaller shrubs - I know, they make more money on the larger ones! I'm finding plants and shrubs listed here as really helpful to our plans.

We bought a dwarf Snowflake Mock Orange from Wayside Gardens and had the landscapers put it in the year we had all the landscaping done. Love it! It bloomed the next year after it was planted and it is extremely fragrant. Great plant! We also put in the dwarf forsythia Show Off Sugar Baby that Kevin mentioned two years ago and love it too. Added an Endless Summer Hydrangea a couple of years ago and it stays fairly small because it dies back quite a bit from the winters - especially last winter- but blooms nicely on new wood during the summer.

Keep your suggestions on smaller plants/shrugs for the landscaping coming. They are so helpful.
Linda

Surprised there is only one mention of Fothergilla -- this is a fantastic shrub! My favorite cultivar is Blue Shadow, with bluish leaves, but alas I couldn't find any locally when I was planting the front shrub border so settled on the plain green ones. Outstanding disease-free foliage, fragrant "bottlebrush" flowers in the spring, superb flamin' orange foliage in the fall -- what more could you ask for?

I also think Winterberry hollies (Ilex verticillata) are very attractive shrubs; I don't know why this shrub is so under-used in these parts...

Diervilla "Cool Splash" is a great shrub for a refreshing pop of white and green foliage and does well in sun or part-shade.

Don't forget tree peonies; even if they didn't bloom, I'd grow them for the outstanding foliage.

Rugosa roses are tough as nails, they will laugh off your Zone 4 cold.

I'm not sure about just how drought tolerant any of these are, though. I do know Ilex prefers moist soils but will tolerate some degree of dryness. Hydrangeas are NOT going to like it arid/dry, so I would advise against hydrangeas unless you are willing and able to provide supplemental water. The oakleafs are a bit more tolerant of dry conditions, but not by a whole heck of a lot.

Was just rereading the posts and I second the Rugosa Rose suggestion. I have 3 - Blanc Double de Coubert, Hansa, and Crimson King, the last one was purchased in a small box at Aldi, of all places. They are tough as nails, do not like to be over fertilized, can be sheared back or left to do their own thing. They are very fragrant - I can smell Hansa from all over the yard when she is in full bloom. I have one near the main road and it is not bothered by the road salt - another plus. I'm looking up the Purple Pavement mentioned above now.

Linda

This is a fantastic resource! Thank you to all the contributors.

I have a rugosa rose (not sure which one) and it is made of steel. It even withstood the Japanese beetles.

I LOVE dwarf fothergilla but don't have any at this house (yet!)

Shrub-like herbaceous plants that have done well by me are peonies and hydrangeas... just planted a few Baptisia 'Purple Smoke' and am hopeful they will do well.

This article was great and so helpful! I am re-doing a garden, tearing all perennials out. I will put in dwarf conifers, shrubs, and perennials, so am looking for ideas. I guess I am on the right path, as I was planning to put my peonies back in, as well as balloon flower. I will also plant swaths of purple coneflower, black-eyed susan, and some phlox. I'm in Zone 4 (Wisc.). I will be incorporating Montgomery, Mugo Pine, dwarf cedar, curly pine, nana, sanders blue, and a few others. Planning on putting in Twist and Shout Hydrangea, Mock Orange, Cotoneaster, Strawberry Sundae Hydrangea, and Lemon Candy. Have lots of other ideas. Everyone's suggestions are great!

A brief mention for my current craze - parahebe catarractae. Loving these neat little evergreen cushions - perfect space fillers for the front of a bed - looking good with deutzia gracilis. Sadly, not appropriate for a Z4 garden but for warm xeriscape gardens, this is a winner.

Karin, if you are willing to send for postage, id be happy to take take some daylillies or other perennials.

Great thread got revived, but it is from 2014. Can't think of any information that's outdated, excluding updated experience from individual gardeners who posted earlier.

Oh, fun to see this revived. I can report definitively that the dwarf mock orange, 'Miniature Snowflake' is a total dud for me. I bought 4 and only one remains and it's a sickly mess. Boo.

As a result of this thread I also added a sumac, rhus trilobata, and totally love it. I'm getting some more of those.

I also added many junipers, and a couple more dwarf spruce, 2 'black lace' elderberries, and gobs of peonies. We're getting there!

Emily, for sure! I always have extra daylilies. Currently I have 'hyperion' and 'happy returns'. For perennials I have scabiosa 'Fama', Rocky Mt penstemon, and some 'Magnus' coneflowers. I'm happy to send them! Message me here and we can set something up.

Now I'm going to re-read everything again and see what more ideas I can glean.

oooh, black lace elderberry - what a gem...but can I just mention the similar, but less filigree leafed Black Lady? This has much better flowers....which also makes a delightful, pink elderflower cordial and is also more vigorous and reliable than the Black Lace.

And who can argue with paeonies - hope you are splurging on some of the species?

Thank you so much, Karin! I would love some of your penstemon and coneflowers. I will message you now :)

I found this thread by searching for "potentilla" in the search bar and am reviving it because of the awesome info contained within! I am currently planning a new garden bed in my zone 5b and threads like this are so educational for me. Thanks to all who contributed!

This is a great thread! And since my post 6 (wow, 6?!) years ago, I have added more dwarf shrubs to my garden. Most of these are in the last year or two, and little starter guys at that, so I don't know yet how they will perform:

'Kodiak Black' bush honeysuckle (Diervilla)

'Little Quick Fire' hydrangea

'Low Scape Mound' aronia

'Little Ditty' viburnum

'Panther' ninebark - this one is supposed to be mildew resistant and 2 years in it has had perfect foliage

'Munchkin' oakleaf hydrangea

Birds nest spruce

'Lemon Fizz' rose

'Mount Airy' Fothergilla (still in pots)

'Bartzella' Itoh peony

'Color Guard' yucca & hellebores - not technically shrubs but I don't do anything to them other than trim back dead leaves once a year.

My local big box store has a mega clearance at the end of the season and I picked up some dwarf barberry and 'Little Princess' spirea for $1 as fillers 4-5 years ago. Not especially interesting but they pretty much take care of themselves!

I also planted some large shrubs to use as multi-trunked small trees:

'Temple of Bloom' heptacodium

Xanthocerus sorbifolum (from seed)

Hopefully this thread will get bumped again later down the road and I can update! I hope others chime in with what they've tried too.

Greenhearted - what zone do you garden in?

I'm also adding shrubs here and there. Three seasons ago I bought a 'Little Lime' Hydrangea and liked it enough to buy another the next season. But one issue I've had is that it starts off the season a well shaped even frame of branches and as it starts to grow it shoots up a handful of branches straight up about a foot higher than the rest. I'm told that once they mature they will even out. I'm hoping. This is the 2nd and 3rd year for these two shrubs and they are just forming blooms, so we'll see. I will post some photos once they do.

I bought a dwarf Mock Orange - I'll have to look up the name. It had double flowers - small but double. I was thinking it was just okay and I didn't really notice any fragrance, but this year, wow, it was fragrant. Drifting in my windows fragrant. It had more impact for longer than my Viburnum carlesii, the Syringa paladin and some of my roses. So I am looking for another, but a different variety. I was interested in that 'Minature Snowflake' - too bad that was a dud.

I'm in Zone 5, Northern IL. I thought I had that listed but I guess that went away when gardenweb merged with Houzz. I'll have to see if I can add that.

I had heard from fellow gardeners that the mock oranges were somewhat like forsythia in that there is a brief show and not much attractiveness outside that period. Sounds like they might be worth another look!

Edit: I just updated my profile name to include the zone/location. Thanks prairiemoon for bringing that to my attention

greenhearted...excellent information. I am just curious as to the real world size of your Little Quick Fire hydrangea.

Prariemoon2, I have Little Quickfire and it does the same thing - shoots up a handful of branches that are a foot taller than the rest. It did that last year and I resisted the urge to cut them, hoping I'd get some late season blooms, which never happened. This spring, I reshaped the shrub, cutting off all those tall branches...they're now flowering, so no harm done.

My LQFs are in their third year, purchased as 3 gallon plants. Those I have planted in full sun are about 4 ft tall. The ones I have in part shade are much smaller, though each flower equally well. LQF is a great shrub!

Greenhearted, thanks for updating with more shrub choices! Very helpful for a novice gardener like me.

Greenhearted, your friend is correct. It is a brief 2-3 weeks of bloom and then plain green the rest of the year. Not even fall color. I suppose I could have put in something else, but it was going in a bed under my Dining Room windows and it's not something I look at out the kitchen or dining room windows, on the other side of the yard, so it fits what I needed and fragrance is a priority for us. We seem to have a series of plants that are fragrant over the season and mock orange is also fragrant when a lot of the spring burst is over.

LoveMyCorgi - I had the same issue last season with the first Little Lime I planted and I did cut off the branches and I shaped them both this spring and they shot up branches again. So, I'm not sure how that is going to work out, but I'm hoping it will work itself out. Your LQF sound great, thanks.

Those I have planted in full sun are about 4 ft tall.

Thanks for that lovemycorgi.

(I would bet that it isnt in full bloom yet given your location bu when it is later this month could you post a picture or two?)

Hi Rouge, hopefully I'll be able to give an update on LQF in a few years. I only just planted it last year and it was basically a 3" twig! It's filling in nicely though this year, clean attractive foliage. I've heard good things about it and glad to see LoveMyCorgi's experience agrees.

Thanks prairiemoon for the info about the mock orange.

Hi greenhearted, I also plant lots of shrubs and evergreen (conifers) in my garden beds. Here are a few pics:

spirea Little Princess

Picea pungens glauca Thume, weigela Spilled Wine, spirea Goldmound

Pinus contorta Taylor’s Sunburst at the back

Barberry Concorde

a trio of Thuja Jantar

False cypress and hydrangea Bobo

Englemann’s spruce Jasper

A trio of Picea pungens Montgomery, and a continus

Hard to see, but a dwarf amelanchier, Isaac I think.

Well shoot, I had a reply typed up and it didn't save!

mazerolm, great pics!! I love your collection of conifers and I definitely need more in my gardens. That new growth on Taylor's Sunburst is so eye-catching.

I didn't know cotinus is hardy in your zone - which one do you have? I have been eyeing the 'Winecraft black' which is supposed to stay a manageable size.

I looked up Isaac amelanchier and sounds like a good find! I've been trying to plant more no-spray fruit bearing plants, even if it just goes to the critters. So far I've planted pawpaws, a persimmon and have an Asian pear coming this fall. I plan to get an amelanchier and kousa dogwood down the line (more focused on the ornamental aspect but with edible fruit as a bonus).

Thanks greenhearted! The continus is Royal Purple, we can grow them, but only like perennials. Which is fine by me, it means that it remains a manageable size. If you‘re to get an amelanchier, I highly recommend that you get a variety that’s delicious, as I think not all of them are. Mine are awesome, better than wild blueberries and raspberries!! You won’t regret it! I also have haskap, but they are too sour, I leave them for birds. Someone recently recommended cassis, but I’m not having any luck in finding it locally.

Thanks for the recommendation mazerolm. It looks like Isaac is a cultivar of A. weigandii possibly. Will definitely keep that in mind.

Excellent lovemycorgi.

And the flowers are bright white until they start to turn pink?

Do you mind when you have time to measure for me the height and breadth of that mature specimen?

Yes, the flowers are bright white. Over the next few weeks, the older blooms will turn a soft pink, while the immature blooms will fully bloom, so the shrub will be a mix of soft pink and white flowers, very pretty!

This particular shrub is 47" high and 43" wide. This is only it's third year in the ground, but my full size QF was taller than me after 3 years, and I am 5'4". Full size QF also isn't as densely packed with flowers as LQF. Can you tell I love LQF? :-)

So fun to see this thread revived and a bunch of new ideas! I'm keen on Little Ditty viburnum and Issac amalanchier.

Since I started this thread I have done a lot of shrubbifying and boy am I glad I did! Most of my beds have finally reached the point where they don't need constant maintenance from me, which frees me up for other garden projects.

But I'm still always eager to learn about other options for shrubs, so thanks to all!

Count me in as one loving this revival.