Austins-Munstead Wood vs W.Shakespeare 2000

13 years ago

Autin's reds, with M.W. being the newer introduction. Any comparisons as far as growth habit (height/width/octopus arms?), disease resistance, repeat etc.

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Comments (5)

the_morden_man
13 years ago
Maryl,

I have 7 WS2000's but no Munstead Woods. I will be adding it next year. WS2000 is my favorite Austin however. By comparison, I have planted 3 WS2000's for my Mom and MW was a new addition to her garden last year and was a runt of a plant that Pickering shipped her. Despite this, it performed so well that she prefers it to WS2000 and ordered 2 more.

I grows much more upright than WS2000 and is nowwhere near as large. The fragrance is incredibly strong and the colour is even darker at times than WS2000. It stayed entirely disease free in her east coast garden with high BS pressure and bloomed incredibly well. I believe it is now her favorite Austin and she has a lot of them as they do well in her East Coast garden.
jeffcat
13 years ago
I only grow WS2000, but based on what I have seen...

1: MW tends to more often have a darker bloom color than WS2000 which is more of a deep magenta fading to a subtle crimson.

2: MW APPEARS to grow more upright from what I have seen. WS2000 is a bit of a nightmare to prune correctly as it wants to shoot out very long lateral canes off of upright canes. The growth habit of an established WS2000 is a little better after you play with it a bit. WS2000 will most definitely be wider than tall so 3'x4' is pretty accurate.

3: I obviously haven't smelled MW, but WS2000 has a very intriguing and wonderful scent. While I wouldn't be surprised if MW's fragrance is stronger, I'm willing to bet I would still prefer WS2000's fragrance as it's a bit unique, deep, and warm....personal choice. I also prefer WS2000's perfect bloom form over MW's as well...also personal choice

Disease resistance has been pretty good on my WS2000. It was only in it's 1st year and gets the least full sun of all of my roses at around 6hrs/day(an additional 1.5hours of filtered sun). It's planted on the north side of my house. In it's 1st year it was disease free aside from a little bit of powdery mildew. With that said, it was only it's 1st year so with maturity, it probably would have fended it off. Hard to say how it does now since I spray...just because I can spray, not really because I necessarily NEED to.

The only true red Austin I've ever seen developed is The Squire, although even it can have color variation. LD Braithwaite and Tess of the D'Ubervilles occasionally come close to or are true red from what I've seen.
Worst case scenario..........just get both. XD
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I can't wait to add this rose to my garden this spring, along with 'Young Lycidas'. I have never been Austin-crazy, but these two varieties have given me a serious case of rose lust. Many years ago, in the late 1980s to mid 1990s, I grew 'Othello', 'Graham Thomas' and one other I can't remember in zone 5b Michigan and I can't say I was really impressed. They were awkward, lanky, diseased growers for me (even if 'Othello' did have a swoon-worthy fragrance). It appears that many of Austin's more recent introductions are truly significant improvements. Thank you to all of you for sharing your experiences with 'Munstead Wood'! :-) Ispahan This post was edited by ispahan on Wed, Jan 30, 13 at 9:00
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Sounds like I need one more irresistible rose! Karen, thanks for posting the beautiful pictures and giving your input on Munstead Wood. Very interesting observation that your alkaline soil makes the color of the blooms of MW a lighter one. I have very alkaline soil and water and I noticed to my surprise that the first bloom that William Shakespeare 2000 has opened is much lighter than the flower is came with from Chamblee's. I like the darker bloom much better and maybe I will put some soil sulfur anorund the rose and see what happens. On the other hand I am growing 'The Prince' and this rose has the darkest velvety flowers of all the roses in my yard. Who knows maybe only some rose varieties are sensitive to alkaline soil/water in terms of changes in their flower color depending on their breeding lineage. JumboJimmy, in my garden Heritage shatters very quickly, it is almost annoying, but William Shakespeare 2000 seems to hold it blooms much longer. the bustopher, you are right, 'The Prince' burns in the heat very easily in my garden, too. It would be such an improvement if Munstead Wood wouldn't do that! Thanks for sharing this important observation! Christina Here is a link that might be useful: Organic Garden Dreams
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Andreark, I planted a Munstead Wood from Austin, bare-root, this year and had a short but lovely flush. I mean short -- we're talking two weeks. I talked to a gal who gave a talk on Austins this past weekend at Otto & Sons Rose Days,and she said, "Munstead Wood is not a particularly vigorous rose." I don't mind if the bush stays small -- it's supposed to, and besides it's in a container -- but I sure would like more flowers. Darcey Bussell, which I bought in a 3-gallon, has been blooming for 3 weeks with no sign of stopping, and its fragrance is almost as nice as Munstead's. Oh and by the way, my Falstaffs (I have 2) haven't flowered once this year. Not once. They do get partial afternoon shade -- are yours in full sun? Thanks, Sylvia
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These are both terrific and unusual roses for color and scent. As Terry noticed already, Summer Song, which has arguably the most unusual and lovely orange hue I've ever seen in a rose, is not the best of rebloomers, currently 3 flushes a year on my plant (grafted on multiflora, I think, by DA-UK) which is now in its third season with me (first year: one flush). While it's not very resilient to BS, it does fairly well in my no-spray garden, spotting, but not much defoliating. It's a tall, vaseshaped plant with glossy leaves. The scent is deliciously banana! Munstead Wood on the other hand is already a terrific bloomer, quite vigorous, with petals of a thick velvety substance with a lovely shine to them. The color varies between a crimson purple of darker and lighter patches, and, in the cooler days of spring, an incredibly deep, black red, the blackest I've ever seen, and wonderfully many-petaled immensely large flowers. The damask scent takes a while develop when the flowers open, but is superb, once it's there. Health has been average so far, it eventually caught quite a bit of BS in my no-spray garden and lost some leaves, but we've had literally endless rain in July and August, and it's sitting next to the BS magnet The Dark Lady. Now it's rebounding quickly and keeps on blooming. One caution: it's an incredibly thorny rose, similar to Gertrude Jekyll, perhaps even more so. But it doesn't show any tendency toward lankiness or legginess, and has so far remained fairly short and manageable. Highly recommended. Andrea
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hoovb zone 9 sunset 23
13 years ago
In my garden the grafted WS2K has an oddball growth habit, it would be 6' wide, 3' tall, if the walls adjacent didn't push the canes upwards. The canes go straight outwards like helicoptor propellers where the walls don't push them up, rather than being arching-octopus-y. This is one rose that may really benefit from Austin's advise to plant three in a triangle. Three would make a fuller, lusher looking group. The own-root version is smaller, say 3x2, and bushier. The own root has taken a long time to get going, but probably my fault as it is dry in that spot.

I want to try Munstead Wood too, it sure looks gorgeous!
the_bustopher z6 MO
13 years ago
I have both Munstead Wood and WS2000. The Munsteads are new this year so it is too early to tell on them other than to say that both plants of MW are going. WS2000 almost wants to grow sideways rather than up. It seems to be doing better this year now that it is the 3d year after that bad Easter freeze. It has more new growth and looks like it will do okay. WS2000 does have a nice smell.
noseometer...(7A, SZ10, Albuquerque)
6 years ago
Old thread, but I've been growing WS2K for the last 5 years, and this is the second year for MW. For me, both plants are rather sprawly. YMMV since all roses seem to perform unexpectedly in my climate.

WS2K:

Sprawls from basal canes.

Broader leaves, with more leaf coverage.

Less thorny.

Tends towards chlorotic.

Fuller flowers, more perfect quartering, and more even coloring. Lighter overall color.

Longer recharge time than MW.

Strong violet fragrance, stronger to my nose than MW.

Flowers sensitive to heat and sunlight, getting burned edges or frying completely.

Thorns:

Bush:

MW:

Branches higher up, branches spread outwards rather than up.

Smaller leaves.

Very thorny, almost bristly. The appearance is more of a briar patch than a rose bush.

Tends towards yellow older leaves.

Flowers usually not quartered, with very uneven, almost blotchy coloring (like Burgundy Iceberg). Overall darker colored. More variability in color between flowers and more variability depending upon the weather.

Rebloom is faster than WS2K. More flowers overall.

More damask fragrance. Lighter to my nose than WS2K.

Tolerates heat and sun better than WS2K.

Blotchy:

Same bush, same day photographed as above flower:

Some petals much darker:

Thorns:

Bush:

Austins-Munstead Wood vs W.Shakespeare 2000

Comments (5)

the_morden_man

jeffcat

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