Hi Der,

Nope. Water hammer is a shock wave that results from a valve shutting too fast with no outlet before it hits another valve or pipe end. Do you have a vacuum breaker on one of the goosenecks that releases water when the valve closes. It is usually local water code that you have one. This isolates the house from the valves. The irrigation heads usually absorb the shock from the lawn side unless your heads are the I20 type that have backflow-preventers at the irrigation heads and don't absorb the shock. I would change the valve out or check your water pressure. It may be too high. If your getting water from your house, high pressure is not doing your appliances any favors either. You can get a faucet water pressure meter from your hardware store for around 10-15 bucks. Jmho. Then again I may be wrong. Aloha.

Hmm... I read somewhere that the longer the pipe before the valve, the more water traveling inside the pipe, the more momentum, therefore the more hammer.

Interestingly, the 2 original valves that are right where the water enters the house do not create water hammer (they are anti-siphon valves).

The valve far away from the house causing hammer is of the same type, anti siphon. It might be not high enough though (needs to be at least 6 inches above the highest sprinkler head and this is not the case).

Is this a good model to use: http://www.rainbird.com/diy/products/valves/das_asvf.htm ?

Another thing I read (at Irrigation Tutorials) is that you could add another pipe in parallel from the house to the valve, which will cause water velocity to be reduced and can eliminate hammer. A lot more work though, digging trenches, etc.

What about water hammer arrestors? Are they too good to be true?

Hi Der,

Velocity are the factors. Velocity of the valve slamming shut and the velocity of the water traveling in the pipe. Increasing the diameter of the pipe slows down the velocity of the water and improves the situation. Instead of a parallel pipe just replace it with a larger diameter one. That is what a design does. Sizes pipe diameter to the flow demand of the system thus eliminating w-H with valves that close too fast. Some system are designed for one demand and then someone changes the demand for that system causing problems. If I am in error on this others please contribute and clarify this discussion. Thanks Aloha

Hi Lechua13,

Thanks for all the replies. I should measure the pressure, good advice.

Agreed, velocity is one of the factors. In addition http://www.irrigationtutorials.com/waterhammer.htm also mentions:

"Water hammer is influenced by three variables, understanding these variables will help you find the source of your water hammer problem.

The first variable is the length of the pipe the water is traveling through. We can't do much about the length of your pipes, assuming that you can't move your house closer to the water source. But it is an important factor in creating water hammer, so it is useful to take a look at it, especially as it relates to the pipe size. For example, in some situations you can force a high rate of flow through a small pipe without problems, provided the length of the pipe is short, say, a few feet. The shorter the pipe, the smaller it can be. Knowing this will help you when you try to identify the source of the water hammer. So keep in mind that a small pipe may not be a problem if it is a very short length".

I tend to believe him because one other valve which feeds 7 pop-up sprinklers in the front yard is located about 1 foot from the house water supply pipe and does not generate water hammer when it closes.

I considered replacing the pipe with a bigger one, but that would be about 30 feet of digging... Urgh. If I move the valve closer to the house I eliminate the need for replacing 30 feet of pipe. Once I do that though I have no control over the size of the gooseneck or length of the pipe, but just the pressure. I am guessing the pressure regulator for the house is located where the water meter is (near the sidewalk under a cover)?

Thanks,
CG

Hi der,

Whatever you decide to do will either fix it or not then try something else until you solve the problem. It might get fixed and you may think it was one thing but actually another. That is the joy of trial and error. You asked for a second opinion and you got it. When a valve shuts too quickly in a closed conduit it generates a shock-wave from the sudden stopping of the water moving force(momentum). The shock can be produced in any length of pipe. What you hear is the pipe rattling against a stud or loose metal bracket. In your case moving around in your refrigerator. PVC absorbs shock better than copper or steel pipe and will make less noise but break easier. The question is what happens when your auto valve shuts and produces a shock-wave back toward the house. It is not stopped or mitigated until it hits your faucet valves and your refrigerator water supply valve. I have on my irrigation system a vacuum breaker valve before the house that releases pressure and water when my auto valve shuts off. Bugs or debris in the water or calcium build up over time can keep this v-b(diaphragm operated) from operating properly and pass a shock wave into your house. This release fitting is easy to replace or repair(google info). Try this fix first before anything else(cheapest). Check your flow from a faucet on your system (time filling a five-gallon bucket) along with checking your pressure (faucet pressure gauge). With that info you will know more about your problem. Look on the internet if that flow is causing high velocity for the size of your pipe. Changing the size of your main will decrease the velocity or momentum force of the water traveling in your system. Let us know how you solved the problem. Aloha

You mean, this device:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_vacuum_breaker

Aren't the latest anti-siphon valves coming with a AVB built-in ?

Alright, I will do the pressure / flow measurement and go from there.

Thanks!
CG

Yo Der,

Yup and yup. I don't worry about air contaminates getting into the device because I am irrigating my yard. The anti-siphoning properties is the vacuum breaker or diaphragm. I have had mine in operation for years with only one problem. Mud wasps built a nest inside somehow and the diaphragm quit closing. I cleaned it out (easy to clean & repair)and it works great to this day. I believe it helps with W-H but we shall see. Most Water boards (City's) require it as part of your system to ensure landscape water doesn't go back into your house and into their pristine water supply.
I meant to ask if your sprinklers have their own back-flow prevention devices like the I20 series does?
Good luck and aloha.

Anti-siphons... yes on all valves.
On the sprinklers... no. They are just regular RainBird popup sprinklers.

Cheers,
CG

Ciao CG,

I am still interested to know what pressure, flow, size of main line and auto valve size you have. Danke.

Aloha

Hi Lehua13,

I have not measured water pressure/flow yet. I will measure the flow this weekend and let you know.

Here is what I did so far: I moved the valve very close to the house (all the valves are now located in the same place, it's better than before), hammer is still happening but a little less if I turn down the flow control on the valve a bit (but that reduces the flow on the popup sprinklers of course).

Main line is 3/4", valve size 3/4".

More ideas to throw on the table:

- add a water hammer arrestor near the fridge?

- see if the plastic pipe connecting the fridge to the water supply is shaking and making the noise, maybe secure it to the wall?

- add a water hammer arrestor (for ex. a Watts model) on the faucet located just before the valve

Greetings,
CG

Hi Der,

I would do one thing at a time. They are all good ideas. I would put the arrestor in a place that you can recharge it with air (drain the system that the arrestor is part of). But I believe we can find the source of the high velocity and quick closing of the valve. How many(max) heads are you running on one zone. Does the hammer happen on all zone. What happens when the WH is the worst. Have someone listen to the problem while you manually do different things to the irrigation system. Also listen to each valve as you change zones. Does one have a closing sound louder than others etc. Good idea to fasten any loose piping down but you want to eliminate the stress on your system. If I was to put in an arrestor, I would try to put it in between the valves and your manual shut off before your line goes into the house. It would be easier to install and keep air in it. 3/4" is okay line size with a limited demand(Flow need). If your demand is high with a large (many headed and high pressure) zone then your velocity can be very high creating WH problems. Anyone that has more or better ideas please jump in the thread. Aloha

Some more data:

- hammer happens only on one zone, with 7 pop-up sprinklers (I have 4 zones, 2 of them are low pressure drip irrigation)

- seems to be a bit worse in the evening

- I measured the flow at a faucet. 15 quart bucket filled in 19 s. That gives about 700 gallons per hour.

Cheers,
CG

Howdy Der,

The pressure regulator for the house is usually in the garage wall before the mainline enters the house. The pressure regulator may be faulty allowing high street pressure into your house and out again to your irrigation pipes. This can damage your appliances that use water. They are rate for around 45-50 psi of operating pressure. Street pressure can be 70 psi or even up to 125 psi depending upon the municipal storage reservoir water level elevation above your house. Using the water pressure gauge on your hose faucet can allow you to see the adjustments you make at your pressure regulator. The hose bib water pressure gauge can be found at any hardware or irrigation supply store.

Let's say your irrigation heads, sprinkler optimum pressure is around 30 psi, use about 1.5 gpm average head flow. Some heads can put out more some less. 7 x 1.5gpm is 10.5 gpm. Your system total per your calcs is 700 gph or 11.6 gpm. When pressure goes up from 30 to 50 psi your head flow goes up which would over tax your system and cause the water to fly through the pipes. When the valve shuts it is trying to stop a greater velocity of flow than your system was designed for. High velocity equates to de-accelerating a mass of water in the pipe. Force = mass x acceleration or de-acceleration. Force is your shock wave. De-acceleration become extremely fast or a large value as time squared gets very small(denominator). Check your pressure. Aloha

Yikes... got pressure gauge and took a measurement on faucet near the mainline: 90 psi!

I don't see a pressure regulator where mainline enters the house. Maybe it is in the water meter box located in the front yard near the sidewalk?

Yo Der,

Houston we have a problem! Now I am pretty sure it would not be in the water meter box. It will be in the garage wall with a access panel on the wall to get to it. Can you follow it's path through the garage wall? It is usually close to the garage door opening. It is a fairly large brass fitting about 8" high with a large bolt on the top that is soldered in-line on your copper water main. If your garage walls are closed with sheet rock, listen for water sounds in the garage. With that pressure you should be able to hear it whistle through the pressure regulator since it is a constriction in the line. If you can't find it get a plumber to help you. If you don't have one get a plumber to help you. That pressure will cause major leaking of your gaskets and water appliances sooner than later. I'll bet your shower gave you a good massage. Look on line to see what they cost. Good luck. Let us know what happens. Aloha

Nope, I don't see any pressure regulator. Water enters the house through a hole on the side. No noise in the garage. House was built new 4 years ago.

I wonder how many people get a high water pressure and never worry about it? Or they just say "yeah whatever" when they get water hammer.

I'll checking with plumbers, but I am just curious, what are the skills involved in adding a regulator myself? I am thinking it should go right before the water meter (when looking from the house), in the front lawn, in a hole covered with a plate for easy access. Or I could just add a pressure regulator before the offending valve (easier - connects to PVC pipes), but that would still leave the problem of too much pressure in the house.

Best,
CG

Hi der,

Did you buy this house new? When you say "Water enters the house through a hole on the side.", do you mean in the garage wall or into the house proper? Is your hot water heater in a separate room/closet or in the garage. If your WH is in a separate room/closet the pressure regulator may be just before your WH in that room. Do you live in a rural area or more of a new subdivision community. If it is the latter, your builder may still be around and you could contact them with that question of where did you put the PR when you built the house. Maybe your water company has changed or improved your pressure zone( they would notify you). The easiest thing would be to contact your City or county permit office. Talk to a plan reviewer, they would know where it is because they reviewed the plans for the building permit. They might have a set of plans of your house on file by the builder for the permit. If you don't want to do all that, hire a plumber and pay him to install one or locate the one you have. The PR is $60 and installation would take an hour to install @ $90/hr if he has easy access to the mainline. Ask for the estimate up front by three plumbers. You can check his pressure settings with your new pressure gauge when he/she's done. Your pressure should be 50 psi. No more water blasting from your faucets and showers and probably no more water hammer. Aloha and good luck.

Hi Lehua13,

Water enters through side of the house, not garage. House is new, set of 2 houses that took the place of an older house. Water heater is in the garage, has an expansion tank (I think this is required for pressure regulator).

I contacted the builder, he said there is no regulator. Ha!

I am getting quotes from plumbers now.

Cheers,
CG

Hi der,

I am amazed that a builder was not required to install a PR in your house, especially with the pressure you have in the street line. If he installed your water fittings and appliances and knew about the pressure. They might be considered negligent. Check with your water company what code might be in your area. I wonder if your neighbors have the the same problem. You are on the right track.

Aloha.

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. I know life is expensive there... but this?

First plumber estimate

$575 part and labor. Because of the tight space around where mainline enters the house, they say it is 2 or 3 hours total, including getting parts. They say regulator is $150, because it is 1 inch, and a $60 regulator is going to fail. What gives?

I got 2 more plumber estimates coming.

Cheers,
CG

OMG Der,

You live in SF, CA. This is why you get three bids. I hope you are letting them know you are getting other quotes. If all three are at that range then that is what it costs in SF, CA unless all the plumbers you called are related. A 1" mainline is a large feed for a regular house so that ups your expense right there. Do you have a large house with a bunch of bathrooms and sinks and a large yard. You would have to go with a larger regulator($150 should be top-of-the-line). You probably can find a more spacious spot to put the regulator. It doesn't have to be as it enters the house but it has to be before any take-offs for water usage. It shouldn't take three hour even in a tight spot. Did you talk to the builder? Was he required to put one in when he built the house? He may know where he should have put it. Good luck. What did the Plumber say about the pressure and why one wasn't installed? Good luck.

Not a large house no, not a large yard either. Regulator has to be before it enters the house as I want to reduce the pressure to the branch that feeds the irrigation valves. The irrigation mainline branches off the 1" pipe that enters the house.

Otherwise, it could be under the front lawn in a box, and it would probably even cost more to install that box and dig 12-18 inches...

First plumber quote: $575.
Second plumber quote: $656 (and he said that includes a rebate, hmm).

If I was crazy I would attempt it myself, but the space is tight, and would have to learn how to sweat pipes something like 3 inches from the vinyl siding without melting it. Maybe I should post a picture here?

First plumber said code requires regulator for pressure above 80 psi and that if it passed inspection the pressure must have been lower at that time. Builder just said "no regulator", that's all I got from him. Will ask him more questions.

Cheers,
CG from expensive CA

Herr Der,

Here is what I would do. Call the Water Company that supplies your house with water and ask them what the zone working pressure is for your street or address. If it is over 80 psi, I would have a chat with the City permit office where he obtained his permit. If the plumber is correct and you get a positive reaction from the City, the builder is liable for what you are doing. I would then talk to the builder again. Are you the original owner and dealt with the builder? Is there warranties when you purchased the house? Did the previous owner transfer the warranties for the house to you? You can see where I am going with this.

Many people have their house and irrigation with separate take-offs. The landscaping takeoff before the pressure regulator to get higher pressure because the house pressure regulator is usually set 40-50 psi and the landscape system usually is optimum at 50-60 psi. You would still need a separate irrigation pressure regulator for your landscape side but it is cheaper and an easy DIY project.

The plumber will probably put an insulation blanket or pad against your siding. Also talk to them about the pros and cons of using compression fittings(definitely riskier) on the pipe instead of soldered joints. It may not be allowed by code but ask any way. Do you have a convenient shut-off for your house. This may be a time to have the plumber install a ball or gate valve to easily shut water off during an emergency on your mainline(builders usually put a gate valve in valve box in the yard after the water meter). Any one else want to give their $0.02. Is there a better way to look at this issue. JMHO, Aloha

The water hammer might be diminished by turning the flow control stem on the top of the valve down.

turn the zone in question on, then go to the running valve, and turn down the handle in the middle of the valve itself, if you do have the one in the pic you linked to. Eventually the valve should shut off manually, then open the valve until the heads run well, not all the way.

Sometimes when the valves are all the way open, the diaphragm inside will slam shut when the zone closes. If the diaphragm were not allowed to travel to the full open position it may close softer.

Tom

Hi sprinklrdr,

Good advice, I did adjust the flow control a bit, but I need to reduce it more. I'll try what you suggested this weekend.

Hi Lehua13,

The city (Mountain View) says water pressure is pretty much what I am getting and they have no control over that (if they did adjust it, others could get lower pressure as a side effect). They transferred me to the building code division and I am waiting for a call back.

Interestingly, the city of Olympia, WA (I was just browsing and ended up on their web site) recommends installing another box downstream of the water meter, which in my case would be the best solution. See page 2 of their document: http://www.ci.olympia.wa.us/documents/PublicWorks/water%20resources/Pressure_Reducing_Final.pdf They also do offer rebates for installation of a regulator, up to $125. My city doesn't do that though.

Cheers,
CG

Aloha Der,

It is getting more interesting as you probe deeper. Great site. Think about installing a water shut off valve that is easy to access for water emergencies. Just an interesting fact, there is approximately 0.5 psi for every foot of elevation drop from the City's reservoir(actually water level elevation). Your reservoir is about 180 feet or higher than your street. It could be miles away horizontally and the elevation would be adjusted for friction loss in the piping. The reservoir elevation will fluctuate with water pressure by 2:1.

Do your neighbors have the same problem as you concerning not having a pressure regulator? Aloha

Hi,

Argh, choices, choices.

So I have a hard time convincing my wife to pay $480 (that's the best estimate I got so far) to install a regulator... am sure neighbor has the same problem but they are selling their house now. And I have a hard time calculating the probability of having a leak in the house due to the high pressure. Maybe it will be fine for 10-15 years, who knows, and by then we will have moved.

City said there is no requirement for installing regulator, but it is "recommended" above 80 psi. Thus I can't have the builder pay for it.

Installing regulator myself in a box is a possibility, I can dig the hole and put the box, but need to sweat copper pipes inline and I am not comfortable with this. What if I mess up the soldering and we end up calling a plumber to finish the job anyway :-)

I am thinking installing a regulator just on the irrigation mainline before the valves, that should fix the water hammer, and it will cost me $50 for the regulator + a few fittings and a hose bib to allow measuring the pressure. Won't fix high pressure in the house but I can always later add a regulator to the mainline. And I can work fine with PVC 3/4" pipes and PVC cement which is what irrigation mainline uses.

Will this gizmo do the job?
http://www.westsidewholesale.com/water-pressure-regulator-valve-with-brass-housing-bronze-3-4.html??cm_mmc=googlebase-_-na-_-na-_-na

Cheers,
CG

Yo Cg,

There's the rub, risk, insurance. What actually are you protecting and for what cost. Talk to more of your neighbors and see what problems they have had over the long term. Some people have a higher tolerance for risk. If you don't put in the PR then put in a valve you can get to quickly in case of a leaky appliance. Is your washer inside the house or in the garage? Is your water heater inside your house or in your garage? Questions like that will be examples of risk. It would be a very good selling point when you sell the house. It will differentiate your house from others. It is your choice. I am disappointed with the builder who obviously was not concerned about doing the best for the customer.

Your idea sounds great. Doing things a little at a time. Find a friend that can do the copper fittings. If you have plenty of room to get around the pipe it is not hard. Practice on some small copper pipe. A propane torch, brush on flux, heating the pipe so the solder just sucks into the joint. The local hardware stores will probable show you how to do it. Aloha

Hi Lehua13,

There is already a shutoff valve where the mainline enters the house. Washer and heater are inside the garage, which is about 6 inches below the ground floor level (itself above the ground on a crawl space). So if it was to flood, it would probably limit damage to the garage (uh right, "probably", let's ask Mr. Murphy). As for the builder he did a lousy job overall. For example, the A/C was leaking (condensation) and it turns out the drain pipe wasn't connected to the proper drain on the A/C. That one he fixed for free at least.

Adjusting flow control did reduce hammer a bit but did not eliminate it. If I reduce flow too much it will reduce coverage of the sprinkler heads too.

More to practical questions now... if I install a PR only on the irrigation line, I will work with PVC pipe and install a bronze PR. Is it ok to use teflon tape first on the PVC male thread and then pipe dope on top of the teflon tape before connecting the PR (with threaded female in/outlets)?

Cheers,
CG

Hi CG,

Use Teflon Tape or pipe dope but not both together. Just make the Teflon tape a little thicker. Sounds like your covered. Strong water pressure in the house and lower pressure for the irrigation system (will help your drip side). Turn off your house faucets slower than usual will help with WH. The pressure reduction should isolate your hammer to just the irrigation lines though. You'll see if that works.

The builder is a disappointment. I'm sure he did a good job on the house itself but just diddled with the details to save some money. Oh well, good luck and aloha.

Hi Lehua13,

Ok, I will stop hammering (ha) this thread and get to work with the PR :-) For drip side I don't have problems as all the 3 valves for drip irrigation have a small 25-35 psi pressure regulator downstream.

Interestingly only the two similar houses (one of which we bought) were built as "modular" homes with overall low quality materials but the next houses the same builder did in the neighborhood were built normally and with better quality. When we bought, it was 2005 and everyone was getting crazy to build and sell as fast as possible :-)

Cheers,
CG

Hi Herr CG,

As long as the builder built to the local building codes you should be good, but you will run into minor irritations like no pressure regulator and noisy pipes not secured properly. Modular housing usually has very good framing and general construction. Modulars are harder to plumb and wire than normal houses. At least your fortunate you are experiencing high water pressure and not low pressure. You can fix high pressure fairly easily. You have all the information too take care of all sort of irrigation situations. Good luck adios.

Hi Lehua13,

As for a modular house there is not much visible difference with regular houses. Seems builder has backed away from modulars in the neighborhood after building these 2 houses though.

I am this close to doing the job myself and put the regulator where mainline enters the house. Have already the design on paper. I am considering these fittings:

http://www.probite.com/fittings/copper-push-connect-fittings/

I am checking with the city now if they are approved.

Regulator including parts and fittings should be about $200, no soldering required. It's expensive because everything is 1", but still 3 times less than having a plumber over. I doubt a plumber needs 3 hours for this. An experienced guy could do it in an hour I think.

Cheers,
CG

Aloha CG,

Good, we are back in action. You are correct about the estimated time. Sweating joints in copper pipe is not hard and most of the work can be done on a work bench and not in the trench. I could describe it for you if you like.

Those are very DIY friendly fittings, reasonably priced by the quotes on that site. The Building Dept. probably won't like them because they don't take risks in approving modern, innovative and less costly systems. Then again, they may not care what you do after your water meter. A little added insurance for slip on fittings is to lock the line segments at bends and valves with small concrete reaction blocks(weight). So water hammer and forces at the bends and restricted points hit against a solid block of mass equal to the force turning the water in the pipe. Again, acceleration of water plays a big part in the equation. Probably a 3/4 cubic foot of fence post concrete would do the trick. Dig a hole at the 45 degree from the bend or around the pipe at the back of the valve and fill with concrete above and below the pipe. Wrap the pipe with plastic before pouring concrete. To do things right, it is not easy. Anyway, I can help as the further along you go. Aloha

Aloha lehua13,

Ok, here is my plan.

Currently, I have (scissors indicate where I plan to cut the pipe with a pipe cutter):

{{gwi:327203}}

Now I plan to do the following:

{{gwi:327205}}

Note only the 2 elbows on the mainline would be ProBite fittings. The rest of the rig would be soldered and threaded.

I don't have room for a concrete block there... What's the risk of using these fittings? Seems from their diagrams that they have metal "teeth" biting into the pipe preventing it from detaching from the fittings.

Here is one more pic:

{{gwi:327206}}

Cheers,
CG

Yo CG,

Looks like a pretty darn good plan to me. If the fittings are restrained with teeth then you are good to go; no reaction block needed. That ball valve is in a really good spot. Put your pressure gauge on the faucet and adjust your pressure regulator to what you want. I wouldn't be surprised if your Whammer is gone for good. Good plan. Grow a little bush in front of it all and you are community association approved. ;) /)/)/) Smooth sailing. JMHO Aloha

Hi Lehua13,

No community association, it's a single family home. These HOAs can be a real pain (oh, but you can't park here, mister, and please move that garbage can back in, or else :-)

I called ProBite, they said they are approved in CA.

Alright, now on to parts ordering... Thanks for all the advice! Will keep posted on progress.

Cheers,
CG

Hi

I got all the parts, need to build the assembly before installing the bypass on the water main entering the house.

Couple more questions:

- because of space constraints I need to remove the ball valve on the house side, so my only option is to shut off the water before the water meter near the sidewalk. Any risk doing so? It looks like a 1/4 turn ball valve.

- is this the correct procedure for shutting off water?

1) turn water heater thermostat to off
2) close ball valve on cold water supply to water heater
3) close ball valve before meter near sidewalk
4) open lowest faucet and drain
5) perform repairs
6) turn water back on at sidewalk
7) reopen ball valve on water heater
8) set thermostat on heater to where it was

Cheers,
CG

Hi Der,

Your list looks very good(more than I ever thought of) just one minor addition. When you turn the water back on, do it very slowly until you don't hear any hissing noise and leave a sink faucet open as you do this to let all the air out of your system. Turning water off at meter is not problem just not as convenient as near or in the house. The street shutoff should be a 90 degree turn or the arrow on top perpendicular to the pipe. With your high pressure do things slowly. Good Luck. Aloha

Alright, making some progress. Here is the gear:

{{gwi:327207}}

View from above:

{{gwi:327208}}

I tested it with a garden hose at 80 psi for 15 minutes and there are no leaks. Phew!

Now I have a slight problem in that the pipe at the top isn't exactly parallel to the pipe at the bottom. I don't know why this happens, since I bought a one-piece U bend and up to the regulator pipe seems to be pretty parallel. I guess I need to bend it a bit so that they are aligned. Any suggestion on how to do that? insert a special spring in the pipe to avoid kinks?

Cheers,
CG

CG,

See, sweating copper joints isn't so hard as long as it is not in a small confined space. Good looking job and pressure tested to boot. I think you are a closet manufacturer. Looking at your diagram, are those two ends supposed to be going into Probite bends. Is the threaded end a screw-on swivel? Are the Tee and Probite fittings installed ready for this assembly? I wouldn't worry about bending the two segments to match. Just slightly put pressure and connect the ends to your bends. There will be some slight stress in the copper curved portion at the end but it should be able to take it. How exciting. Just do it carefully. Famous last words. JMHO. Good luck. Aloha

Alright, I finally installed the rig this weekend. Whammer is gone. Yeehah!

{{gwi:327209}}

I am impressed by those Probite (and other *Bite brands). It would have been a real pain to sweat in there, the pipe coming out of the house kept dripping all the time even after I thought I had fully drained the system. With those couplings, wet connections can be done without a problem.

Thanks for all the advice, lehua13!

Now on to my next (small) project: fix low head drainage.

Cheers,
CG

Hi CG,

Man that looks professional. Glad everything turned out well. Show your neighbors and charge them $500 a pop. I hope you did it for less than that. Actually great job. Just put an artificial rock over it and when it rains you have a little waterfall. Next job I have I am checking out the Probite fittings. Thanks for that tip. GL on the low head drainage. Aloha

Well, if you think of it, $500 is not that expensive after all, but at least I learned sweating :-) Almost $280 in parts (copper ain't cheap, especially the male adapters, the U bend, and the ProBites) including all the little tools (brushes, micro tube cutter, deburrer, etc.), and the first few joints I messed up and for which I had to buy more fittings :-)

Anyway, I talk too much... :-D

Hasta la vista,
CG

CG,

Thanks for being honest. Sometimes plumbers are worth their weight in gold. My brother in-law(the plumber) told me to say that. Aloha