Live moss is attributed great powers but under most culture regimes it slowly dies. Any chlorine at all in the water will kill it off, any hardness, ditto, I don't even think you can fertilize effectively and keep it alive. Luckily dead New Zealand or Chilean moss retains enough good qualities that most people call it better than good.

H

sources recommended to me for dead moss:

I telephoned Krull-Smith about three years ago. At the time, they purchased from Tropical Plant Products. I purchased some. It is good.

The US Botanic Gardens in Washington, DC buys from OFE International. I will buy more from OFE when I go to Fla next month. It is $20/kilo. I don't know of a price/quantity which matches this for a good quality product.

Many moons ago, I bought a 2 cubic foot box of New Zealand sphagnum moss from Jones & Scully. It is without a doubt the best that I have used. It has long strands which are fluffy. Once put into use, it easily lasts for 3 years. I still have some left; I'm the Silas Marner of dead NZ sphagnum moss from J&S!

If anyone knows of a source of product similar to what I described from J&S, please advise! Thank You.

To the best of my knowledge, most moss available in the USA now is from Chile. Further comment from others, please??

--Stitz--

David Shapiro at rePotme in Maryland has beautiful, fluffy, fragrant (love the scent!) New Zealand sphagnum. I was amazed by the length of the strands. Service is wonderful. Needing repotting materials fast, I called and left a message in the late afternoon. He called me back! That night!

(Disclaimer: I have no association with this business, except as a customer.)

Sweetcicely

Sweetcicely,

Thank you for opening my eyes! repotme.com is less than 10 miles away! I will investigate further!!

--Stitz--

I agree that you can't do much better than NZ finest. I was not, however, impressed with the Chilean version; it was much less fluffy and stayed soggy too long for me. Furthermore, I had problems with scale on every plant for which I used the Chilean moss. No proof of a connection, but even when I used it in a potting mix for houseplants, I got scale. I won't be using it again.

Stitz,

Great! I couldn't remember your location (memory being a sometimes thing) but now recall that you are a MD Phaius grower. How nice that you are so close to rePotme.

Now, maybe Arthurm or someone can recommend a good quality New Zealand sphagnum supplier close to adam.

Sweetcicely

akebono,

My experience has been that the Chilean samples that I see/use are not as high quality as those originating from NZ. My biggest concern mirrors yours--the Chilean seems less fluffy and can remain soggy, especially the latter.

I believe that there are varying qualities available. That is why I asked professional orchidists to recommend their preferred suppliers (Krull-Smith & the USBG). The USBG reference was especially important to me since it is local to me--conditions more similar than those encountered in Fla, Cal or Hawaii! :-)

Two separate, recent Californian suppliers of Lycaste plants used sphagnum moss. One explained to me that it was more difficult to keep Lycaste roots adequately hydrated without sphagnum in San Diego. The other Cal. supplier normally doesn't use sphagnum for other genera so I shall ass-u-me that there was ample reason--probably, the same one.

Really sorry to read about your experiences with scale and sphagnum moss. I am relieved to report that I haven't been able to associate scale with that medium.

--Stitz--

Stitz I bought two kilos of sphag from OFE and have not been happy with it. The fibers are long but lots of junk in it and I've had to add twice as much tree fern to keep the sphag from sinking around my plants when watered. I'm also growing the cutest little grass things in it and have to pluck them out with tweezers.

Anyone want to buy an unopened bag of sphag from me?

Brooke

Brooke,

I agree--there's more "shake" in the OFE baggie than I want to see! I set that aside for use in mixes at a future date.

I don't expect perfection at $20/kilo. Taken into context, that's still a good price.

--Stitz--

I know it's huge and I'm oversimplifying, but I don't think of most of Western Australia as being particularly hospitable to bog mosses and from what I've seen and heard, people who use live sphag to best effect live near where it grows wild.

I see it as being especially problematic for phals. Sphag is not a natively "warm" grower and more importantly, will die in the blink of an eye if watered with fertilizer sufficient to grow phals well.

"Down there", I can't imagine Chilean sphag is cheaper than NZ, and in my and my acquaintances' experiences, the stuff pales in comparison to NZ sphag. Tends to clump up and "go off/sour" much faster than the NZ stuff.

I'm not sure what you mean by "blocks" - I'd be wary of moss compressed very tightly, since I'd think that would have to "crush" the moss, and the biggest selling point is the excellent balance between moisture and retention and aeration - overhandling moss is a great way to ruin that. If you mean slightly compressed "bales", that stuff's fine, just doesn't squeeze or otherwise manhandle it too much when you rehydrate it.

It's a no-brainer. There's no substitue for long-fibered New Zealand sphagnum, period. And when you find a supplier you like (hopefully offering bulk sizes) buy as much as you can because cost and availability varies.

John

Thanks everyone,

orchidsnyc- I think all the moss you can get here is of NZ origin. You can buy it wet/live in bags, in thin compressed sheets which rehydrate in water or loose bales. From what you have said I think the live stuff or bales would be the best (the sheets look suss anyway). I'm growing these plants indoors so hopefully the moss will last a bit longer than it would in a greenhouse exposed to high summer temperatures. Does it matter if the moss dies? will it still function well as a medium? Ive asked a few nurseries and they dont seem to have much knowledge about sphag and what type is best, they just ask "is it for staghorns?" and when I mention orchids its always "we have this special bark orchid mix..."

Thanks again

Adam

Since the NZ sphag we get here is all heat-sterilized, it's all pretty thoroughly dead, though I've read the occasional report of an odd resprout here and there. I'd guess it makes no differences whether it dies a slow natural death or a fast, artificial one :), but I have no real idea.

And yeah, unfortunately, in the areas where orchids are less common "garden" plants (most of the US outside of Florida, California and Hawaii), that kind of response from general garden centers is typical here, too. :(

I got some a few years ago that was wonderful -- but they had no more. Home Depot had some but full of sand. Then I got some which was compressed supposedly 5 year and am still working my way through it. The better quality Chilean is well worth it. Went to great effort to get it and then was at a local garden center and they had it for baskets!! So who knows.

My sphag comes from Orchids Ltd., which is about 20 minutes away. It's compressed into blocks and fluffs up when wet. Some of the strands are 8" long, and there's virtually nothing else in it. It's $48/kilo.

Caveat - it's the only sphag I've used. Has anyone used it as well as other products? I'd be interested in comparisons.

Whitecat8

Here is a link that might be useful: New Zealand sphag

Whitecat8,

I was amazed to read from your link, "This moss will last at least a year." Assuming that the Orchids, Ltd product is a truly high quality NZ sphagnum moss, it will last a lot longer.

The $48/kilo price isn't surprising considering your description that there is very little waste product. This is exactly what I meant in an earlier post when I remarked about the OFE product, "I don't expect perfection at $20/kilo. Taken into context, that's still a good price."

I will be interested to read about how it performs for you over the long haul. I'll bet that you will be pleased!

--Stitz--

Thanks everyone for your advice. Sounds like your sphag is a lot more expensive than over here. I just bought Amgrow sphagnum moss. Its sold live and wet in sealed, clear plastic bags. The 7 liter bags containing tightly packed moss were $14. I'm going to see how they do in it and maybe try the dried bales which are a bit cheaper.

Adam

I have been using something labeled, "Premium Quality New Zealand Spahgnum Moss" in a 500g./40l. bag. I paid $21.95 for this at a local spot, but have since found it at much more reasonable prices (Cal West offers the same quantity for $10.95 plus shipping, for instance). This moss is very high quality. I have seen it act a bit differently in my collection; some turns greenish and some not, with the same overall conditions. A little goes a long way, and I am still working with the originally purchased half kilo, after a year or so.
Ann