Pill bug damage to phalaenopsis

15 years ago

Stitz, this is what I see sometimes in the fall. The pill bugs come up from the floor and move along the benches. They seem to go after the compots and the smallest seedlings. Sometimes I see them on larger plants, but then the damage is just semicircular cuts on the newest leaves or to the tip of a leaf that is touching the bench top. Usually it's no big deal as they respond to insecticide, but in the case of this seedling, the smaller ones got into the center and ate the crown. I can catch them in the act, if I go out at night and check the plant with a flashlight. I have no doubt they are the source of the problem. It was very puzzling the first time it happened about 10 or 12 years ago, but now I know to watch for it when the weather turns cold.

Mike

{{gwi:199760}}

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Comments (16)

stitzelweller
15 years ago
Mike, I'm sorry that you are suffering from pest damage. I don't have much to offer you except my own experience. In over 30 years of growing orchids, I have never seen a Maryland pill bug consume foliage.

Good Luck eradicating your pests!

--Stitz--
smwboxer
15 years ago
I agree, that is not damage from pill bugs. They do not eat living foliage. Actually, looks more like some time of rot/fungus damage.
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Diatomaceous Earth (DE) is one of the safest things you can use on creatures with carapaces (beetles, fleas, etc). DE is a naturally occurring chalklike rock, consisting of fossilized diatoms. It is usually composed of 86% silica, 5% sodium, 3% magnesium and 2% iron. No part of it is toxic, and it even has low levels of beneficial trace minerals. Farmers feed it to their livestock, as they say it cuts down on the worm load and reduces flies/maggots. Some people eat it, too, for the same reasons. The only negative aspects of it: 1) It isn't good for your lungs if you whip it into a cloud of dust, then stick your head into it and inhale deeply, since most stuff that goes into your lungs will stay in your lungs. The DE from saltwater diatoms is apparently more dangerous than DE from freshwater sources (the container often tells which it is). 2) It only works on insects when it is dry. One of the best things about it is, since it is not the chemical action of it that kills the bugs, but the PHYSICAL action, bugs can't build up a tolerance to it like they can chemicals. Seen under a microscope, DE looks like very sharp shards of broken glass. These shards work under the carapace of beetle-type insects and dehydrates them. It doesn't harm bees or earthworms. Your pets and small children can eat it. But it kills things like fleas and cockroaches. TIP: Always buy the kind that says CODEX FOOD GRADE on the label. Some kinds have undesirable chemicals added when used for other purposes. The stuff is usually very cheap, esp if you buy it at the local farm store in a large bag. Call around first, only one place near me carries it. p.s. on the pillbugs: they really don't chew on plants directly. When you see them nibbling on the edge of a chewed area, some other creature usually did the big damage, and the pillbugs are 'tidying up' the decomposing raw edges of the wound. They often take the blame for damage done by earwigs and other creatures of the dark. Sue
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allye, as I mentioned several years ago on this topic, once you go fully organic there should be a resurgence of predators that will take care of the bugs and bring everything into balance. As long as the bugs are not poisoned they should be attractive to birds, lizards, toads, and geckos. Sometimes a bird bath or bird feeder is the best way to control garden insects. I don't think changing the soil mix would be effective. If you have a wooden barrel, it could the the wood lice are there to feed on the decaying barrel. There is a lot of good information in your link. It does make the following statement which struck me wrong, "Unfortunately, the thick mulching and heavy compost use associated with good organic gardening provides Wood Lice with perfect conditions!" I guess I disagree that good organic gardening would necessarily require compost and thick heavy mulching. Guess it depends on what you're doing, but non organic gardeners might do the same things and organic gardens might not. In any case this is a nit and may be my personal peeve. Certainly if you are still following Rodale's guidance from the 1930s, then compost is king. But if you've modernized to the 1990s, then it's not of much importance at all.
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Many people seem to have a lack of knowledge of the role the Pill Bugs, Sow Bugs, Wood Lice, etc. have in nature and so they ascribe the wrong interpretation to what they are and the role they play in nature. These wee critters need a cool, moist environment to live and reproduce in and if you provide that you will have an abundance of them, along with other critters that prefer that same environment that most likely caused the problem you are blaming the Pill Bugs for. I also understand there are those that no matter how many entomologists I use as a source there are those that would rather believe myth and folklore, but I offer the link below for those that would like to educate themselves. Here is a link that might be useful: About Pill Bugs
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I agree with the majority, the little beasties are a true pest! I always thought they were the workhorse of nature and that their good out-weighed the bad but no more! I have great soil and mulch with different kinds of things, pine needles, bark mulch and straw from my chickens. They have multiplied into the thousands. The last 2 years they have eaten off the sprouts of my Angel Trumpets so bad that they have failed to bloom for the last two years. They are in the dead stems from the previous years growth. I can't eliminate them unless I dig up the plant and cut away those stems. It is not happening because the clumps are very large and I worked hard to get them established. They are also in the hostas and in my tomatoes. They get in every house plant that I put out over the summer and I have to repot everything every year or lose them over the winter because the little turds eat the roots and leaves of my house plants. I am ready to use whatever I have to do to eliminate them. I have plenty of birds and toads, frogs and parasitic bugs in my garden, I encourage spiders and all other good bugs and even my chickens will not eat them. I tried and suffered the damage from my chickens in the hopes that they would eliminate the little buggers. Spinosad is a natural organic method of killing pests the same as Bt has been used to eliminate cabbage worms. It is also the ingredient in Comfortis that I give my dogs for flea control. I will try the beer but if it dosen't work I am going to bring out the big guns!!!
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highjack
15 years ago
I would be searching for slugs with that type damage.

Brooke
orchid527
Original Author
15 years ago
Guys, there is no speculation regarding the cause. I caught them in the act. Two or three chewing on the edge of the damaged area and the little ones down in the crown. They had about a week to do the damage, but it is possible that I missed them during the last watering and they might have been at it for 2 weeks. This is not the first time/year this has happened. One possible explanation might be that I grow in Promix and the roots are all pretty healthy. I routinely remove old leaves and it may be that they just don't have anything else to eat but living tissue. I have had similar damage from slugs. That's why I always confirm with nighttime inspections before I start spraying.

Mike
stitzelweller
15 years ago
Mike, I shared your photo with an entomologist who grows orchids. The immediate response was that your photo shows slug damage. I agree.

Perhaps, we have a nomenclature issue. Photos of the perps would be better.

--Stitz--
orchid527
Original Author
15 years ago
Stitz, might be difficult to get pics of them in action since I have already sprayed, but when the temps really drop in a few weeks there should be more coming in from the outside. I can understand mistaking this for slug damage. If I had not seen them actually eating the leaf, that is what I would have assumed. I'll see what I can do. Macro photos at night of bugs that don't like to be in the spotlight might be an interesting challenge.

Mike
chryss
15 years ago
Mike and Stitz,

I do believe we have a nomenclature issue here. Common names do vary from state to state. See below.

{{gwi:199761}}

{{gwi:199762}}

I suggest a catch and then photograph solution.
Chryss
ltecato
15 years ago
If you are talking about the "roly-poly" type pill bugs or sow bugs, not the one in the photo that Chryss posted, those little SOBs absolutely will eat live plant tissue. I know some experts will swear they don't, but I've caught them in the act, too. Specifically, they will decapitate bean sprouts if given a chance. Also, they'll chow down on the exterior of melon-type fruit on the ground.

I've never seen any going after my phals. Admittedly, most of the time they do no harm, but every once in a while they present a problem.
orchid527
Original Author
15 years ago
Itecato, I was referring to the ones that roll up into balls. I'm not sure that I have ever seen one like Chryss posted. Since I buy mostly flask, I usually don't have problems with bugs in the greenhouse, but these guys come up through my pea gravel floor. Glad to hear that others have seen them in action.

Mike
stitzelweller
15 years ago
THANK YOU, CHRYSS!
chryss
15 years ago
Well, now that we know which "pill bugs" we're talking about, here's my story. There are 2 types, the ones that roll up are commonly called "pill bugs" and the type that doesn't are called "sow bugs". I have been squishing them after I water for about 6 months on my plants, mostly on Phals. Those that I have are the sow bugs that don't roll up and they are like Nascars when they want to be ! THEY'RE FAST ! There is NOT ONE BITE on any of my plants but that doesn't mean that I LIKE the buggers or that I don't squish every one I see !!! So, possibly the roll up pill bugs DO and the sow bugs DON'T eat plant tissue.

Chryss
stitzelweller
15 years ago
My good friends in Canada provided the following advice:

"You can also effectively trap pill bugs using a half of a cantaloupe that's placed upside down where pill bugs are a problem."

source: http://www.pestcontrolcanada.com/INSECTS/pill_bugs_sow_bugs.htm

--Stitz--
littlem_2007
15 years ago
hi, I have found that the pill bugs that roll up don't like coffee either. I have watered my plants with diluted coffee and have found them in the saucer later. i have never noticed any damage on my plants.
sue
ltecato
15 years ago
The source Stitz provided verifies that these critters are crustaceans, which I had heard before, and that they breathe through gills. When I was a warped little kid I tried to drown them in buckets of water, to no avail. And my great-grandmother once said the same thing, that they can't be drowned.
stitzelweller
15 years ago
Today, there was a Pill Bug Summit with Chryss and Stitz as host. We turned over a cinder block on my property. We concluded that there are two different pill bug species at our respective houses with only the slow, gray kind here at my house. Chryss lives ~ 4 miles away.

Lord only knows what lurks out in the hinterlands of North America!

--Stitz--
chryss
15 years ago
HEY !! Never thought of that but mine are IMPORTED, unintentionally of course ! I've got 3 possibilities since they DON'T run free inside my house. They (or eggs) came in on my bark purchase, my sphagnum moss, or a newly acquired orchid. I'm betting on the latter, being an orchid from a mutually known bug-hugger !! I forgot that plant but it came with at least one of EVERY common kind of bug you DON'T want to see in your orchids, including mini snails, and centipedes !!! The ONLY thing it DIDN'T have was a tree frog !!!

Back to earth, for having gills the sow bugs sure come running out after you water !!! That's when I wait and squish what I can !!

C-

Pill bug damage to phalaenopsis

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Pill bug damage to phalaenopsis

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