pond pump and filter confusion, help please!!!

16 years ago

I'm so confused! Last year, we installed a small (525 gal) pond/fountain on our terrace. It has a waterfall feature, and the contractor installed a pump to run this. No filter. The pump (Beckett w1150) died within months and he installed another last june which burned out a month ago. In the meantime, I realized that this size pond NEEDS a filter and got a small Beckett filter with pump (inside filter) which I ran separately to help clean the pond. This worked fairly weel, although I still got algae.

Since the last pump died, I realized something is very wrong and emptied the pond of all water and rock from the bottom. I am trying to figure out the best way to piece it back together correctly, but am having quite a bit of trouble. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!

The pond is oval, about 9' x 4'. It is about 2 1/2' deep throughout. The distance from the top of the water to the spillway is about 3'. The spillway is 24" across. The bottom is covered in small river rock about 2" deep. It is painted (drylock) dark gray. The piping to the spillway is 2" piping to the top. There is an elbow at the bottom where the pump connected and at the top forcing the water onto the spillway. It is an above ground, masonry pond in full sun, although the wall with the piping provides a very slight bit of shade to the water. I keep little 12 cent feeder fish in it just for fun.

I need to use submersible equipment as there is really no place to hide the equipment outside the pond and drilling more holes for piping through the walls may cause cracks from vibrations.

Many questions I can't seem to answer in my research!

-What size pump do I need?

-Can I use one pump for both the filter and the waterfall or would the waterfall pump needed be too large a pump for the size filter I need?

-What size filter do I need?

-In what order do I hook everything up?

-Do I need a UV clarifier and if so, do I need an extra pump for that and where does this go in the lineup!?

-Brand recommendations for all this equipment would be so nice!

-Any plant recommendations for this set up for the SE pennsylvania area (in case I get this all put back together!)?

I realize this is a lot of information I am asking for, but obviously I got it all wrong the first time, and I'd really rather not wind up with a huge tree planter in the middle of my terrace! It really is a beautiful little pond when it's running properly and brings me and the neighbors a great deal of joy!

Thank you all for any help you can give me!!! :-)

Comments (5)

sleeplessinftwayne
16 years ago
You have a lot of questions but you gave much more info than most newbies it makes up for it. LOL! I can't answer all your questions but there will be others along to correct that. No one pond is exactly like another and no ponder is just like another. I can't quite visualize your pond but maybe it will come clearer later on.
You don't say why the pumps fail. If it is the same reason each time then I would think you should go to another type altogether. Or provide what it is lacking. If debris is damaging the pump then you need a prefilter which prevents damage to the impeller. Most pumps have a small and totally inadequate sponge in front of the impeller. Most of us toss it and install some sort of prefilter in it's place. Looking at your pump, I don't see even that, just a cap with lots of slots for water flow. Options could be change pump type, or remove filter cap and attach prefilter with sponge or other filter material.
Algae is endemic when the pond gets lots of sun. You could use lots of chemicals but that is rarely satisfactory. A UV filter could work just fine by using a diverter or adding a small pump and filter. With your waterfall pump I suspect a separate pump would be easiest.
More later, Sandy
tmcguinn1
Original Author
16 years ago
I don't know why the pumps have been failing. The first one failed almost immediately while the second lasted a year. It doesn't look like it's clogged with junk, but then it only has those slits, so maybe enough got through them to destroy it. The first failed so quickly and in winter with no fall leaves or fish, so how much junk could have been going through it?

I was thinking of having a pump with one of those sleeve type filters that goes around it to screen debris. The pump could have a filter attached to the intake so that the pond has a filter, then the outlet would pump the water up to the waterfall. I guess a uv would be separeate from all of that and powered separately. I just am so confused as to what size I would need for each piece and what brand. I don't want to be doing all this again in six months!
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It will be a lot, as you face several issues. First issue: This is a very large pond you are looking at, in the range of 11,000 gallons (using the calculations you provided). It sounds as if someone had a very serious koi pond at one time. Although you state you are leaning toward not keeping fish, I would want bottom drains installed in a pond of this size, or you will end up with a mucky mess in a couple of years. If this was a properly designed koi pond, some of that plumbing may still be in place. So the first consideration is that you will need a pump that will filter something on the order of 5,500 to 10,000 gallons per hour, 24 hours a day. A Dolphin Ampmaster ES5500 external pump would perform this function relatively inexpensively, at about 286 watts per hour. I've seen that pump listed for around $400. The second issue is that a pump like the Dolphin will not push water to the heights you are considering for your waterfall. You need a pump that will push 40 feet or greater "well head" height -- the vertical distance that a pump will raise a column of water. For this, you will need a powerful unit like a Sequence Primer which draws around 1500 watts per hour. That is about the same as a large window air conditioner. Where I live in Virginia, the math works out like this: 1500 watts = 1.5 kWh x 7 cents = $1.05 per hour. (I think the national average cost is more like 10 cents per kWh.) Therefore, since you must run filtration 24 hours a day, you are probably looking at two pump systems. The filtration could be accomplished with a low-cost unit like the Dolphin. Your waterfall would be fed by a second very powerful pump that you'd run only for those hours each day when you want to operate the waterfall. You could reduce your cost somewhat by lowering the height of the waterfall. If you are serious about this project, I would recommend first reading up on koi pond design and construction. (There are several websites which specialize in this subject.) Also, some of the experts around here will hopefully chime in. This is not a "garden-variety" pond project that you are considering!
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azponder
16 years ago
With your dims your pond is about 525 gallons. Given the height of your waterfall and the pipe distance that pump is probably putting out somewhere between 400-700 gph. If you are happy with the strength of the water over the falls then your pump should be fine. However, if you add filtration to that pump line it will be underpowered.

If the pump was too small or underpowered, the problem you should be having is not enough flow over the waterfall, not pump burn out (at least not that fast).

I would suspect you either got unlucky with two bad pumps or more likely, something is moving thorugh there damaging the pumps. I would add a prefilter to whatever new pump you get. Or get a pump where the filter is built in (though these are a bigger pain to clean in my experience)

Also make sure you get a solids handling pump that can deal with some gunk on occasion getting through the prefilter. They cost more up front but a burned out pump causing you to buy a new one will cost more as you have learned.

Oase makes some good higher end pumps and filters.
pat_c
16 years ago
Just my two cents. If the pump is submerged in the pond you need some type of filter to keep the gunk from invading the pump. I built two Adam's filters for my two 1000 gal ponds. Easy and cheap. Then I use cheap Harbor Freight pumps in the filter. I paid $59.99 for both and they have been running nonstop for 3 years. Can't beat the price and if they burn up, you're not out that much.
tmcguinn1
Original Author
16 years ago
So, let me see if I have this clear. I want a pump (maybe 1500gph?) inside of a box type filter similar to an adams filter, then the outlet from the pump running out of the filter and into the line for the waterfall? Is this all I will need? Do you think a 1500 gph pump is about right for a 24" diameter waterfall? I had the Beckett 1150 before and the waterflow was pretty good, but there was no filter attached to slow the flow, so I figured to allow for this extra obstruction, I would use a 1500 gph pump.

By the way, this forum is amazing!!! Wish I had found it ages ago! I spend WAY to much time reading old posts, but they are addictive!

pond pump and filter confusion, help please!!!

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pond pump and filter confusion, help please!!!

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