Purchasing seeds from an organic source can help assure you that there will be no Genetically Engineered garbage in those seeds.
Purchasing seeds from an organic source does send a message to the purveyors of GE seeds that people do not want them.

As well, in case the seed packager of the non-organic seeds also produces treated seeds (for fungi, etc.), if you get organic seeds, there is no danger that your seeds may come into contact with whatever chemical/fungicide/etc., that was used, since they aren't used, or allowed, in organic growing. I think they wash the sorting equipment between packaging treated and non-treated seeds, but accidents happen, and residues persist. You are supporting the organic growers and allowing them to compete with the "big boys", and you are supporting the biodiversity of each crop - many organic seeds are of less common varieties, which would disappear if left to the "big boys" - by buying organic.

Those considerations apart, the organic part is more in how you grow the plants that sprout, rather than where the seeds came from. Unless you are certified organic, and need a paper trail with the "right" inputs for every step of the way, you don't HAVE to use organic seeds to grow organic food.

Thanks for the input. I am all for supporting the little guys and sending the message. I have just recently got into gardening and have alot to learn. I love the idea of heirloom seeds. I have several plants on my property that the original owner planted and I want to take cuttings and spread them around the acre. When I told the daughter what I planned on doing she cried, I like the thought of tradition and the heirloom etc.
Thanks again
Jeff

IMHO buying organic for some veggies isn't money well spent. If you buy bean/pea seed, tomato and pepper and others, grow them organically and then save some you'll have your own organic seed for next year. Tom

Remember that hybrid does not mean genetically engineered- it means that one type was crossed with another. That would happen anyway in many open pollination schemes- just that in this case they made sure the right ones crossed to give a wanted trait.

Other than the 'message' it sends there is no difference in the organic versus non organic seeds other than price.

Many non organic seeds are treated with fungicides, but the reason this is done is that some plants are simply prone to fungal problems and the fungi live in the seed so without a fungicide on the seed the sprouts would not only be infected they would infect the garden soil as well.

There are some seeds you will never see offered as organic simply because the law doesn't allow the seeds to be sold without a fungicide being used because of the damage potential to the crop if the fungal pathogen isn't controlled.

Anyway, it's just a seed.

If you plan to spray plants with pesticides then getting organic seeds is pointless and if you intend to avoid pesticide use then organic or not amounts to little in the grand scheme of things since the plant and fruit won't have pesticide residue on them.

GMO seeds may become an issue down the road, but today there are no GMO seeds for home gardeners. The GMO crops are large scale agriculture crops like cotton and soybeans.

I think "organic seeds" is a crock. Who really cares about the gardening methods by which the parent seed stock was grown? It has nothing to do with what grows in my garden or how I manage my garden after the seed is sprouted.

Treating seeds with fungicide is A Good Thing in my opinion. It means higher rate of germination of the seed, and healthier seedlings.

If it is just a "feel good" measure that makes people feel good about themselves or they want to believe they are part of a "movement" then fine. I have no problem with that. But that's all it is.

I agree with justaguy2 it is just a seed, and a seed is a seed. Either it sprouts or it doesn't.

Certified organic seeds are for those growers that are certified organic, that means not someone saying they grow organically but various state or organization certified/inspected/approved farms/produce growers/etc that have met specific strict guidelines.

I would recommend you save your money and not worry about certified seeds unless you are a farm that has been certified and likewise sells certified organic produce, (and if you were, you wouldn't have started this thread.) Also, don't fall into the "grown organically" trap for seeds on ebay and other places, you won't see any benefits by paying more for seeds that are labeled "organic" or "grown organically."

I grow mostly heirloom tomatoes (300+ varieties) & peppers (75 or so varieties) & often sold my extra seeds on ebay every spring. I don't exactly qualify as an organic gardener but still offered certified seed of maybe 10-20 varieties, and went as far as noting the varieties in the ad, and the majority (99.99%) of buyers never even asked for the organic seeds.

If you want organic seeds, grow any seed using organic methods and save your own seeds... except hybrids, which usually don't produce true to type.

Hello all,

I think buying organic seed is a little more than a feel-good measure. I don't choose organic produce based just on my health. Buying organic means supporting organic agriculture, whether you're talking about produce or seeds, which is generally going to be better for that land and thus for the planet we share. That said, I don't always buy organic; I have to take my budget and seed availability into consideration.

Whatever seed you have on hand, give it the best care you can with whatever methods you choose. That's what's most important.

What I said ... to feel like you are part of a movement ... to support kindred spirits who share your belief system ... to feel good about yourself.

I have no problem with symbolic gestures.

To the comment of using your own seeds.. Since I'm very new at this. Can someone explain to me how that is done. I can figure it is after harvest. But what do you do from there?

kubotabx2200 said:

What I said ... to feel like you are part of a movement ... to support kindred spirits who share your belief system ... to feel good about yourself.

I have no problem with symbolic gestures.

kubotabx2200,

My point was that buying organic is more than a symbolic gesture. Buying organic supports organic agriculture. To the extent that the label "organic" represents sustainable practices that don't poison and deplete the land, I'll make an effort to invest in that.

If that's just a symbolic gesture, then so is organic gardening itself.

Regards,
Jim

Some organic seed is tough to get started in colder climates, corn in particular. Organic corn often rots in the pacific northwest as soil temps in the 70's is required for germination.Treated corn seed will germinate in the mid 50's. I use treated and organic both, but use organic fertilizers and natural controls. Much of my organic seed is started inside a hot house with suplimental light, including corn in sod pots for the first plantings. When the soil warms I use treated seed of the same variety for direct sowing.I tried direct sowing organic corn this June and all rotted. The second planting was treated and all is up now.

Another option to get organic corn to grow in small gardens is to use a blue tarp to cover an area to heat the soil prior to planting, pull the tarp off, plant the seeds and cover again until seeds sprout. Organic corn seed can also be germinated inside a warm room on moist paper towels. When the seed cracks and the root shows they need to be carefully planted in the garden.

It's a lot of fuss and feathers doing an organic garden, but the soil stays healthy and you don't have to wear the hazmat suits to apply controls except maybe for 20% vinegar,nasty stuff.

I have a question.

If you are growing organically for reasons of health, you want to limit the amount of chemicals you eat, will that really be affected by whether the parent plant of the seed had chemicals?

I can't imagine that chemicals used on the parent plant would be transfered to the seed and then finally to the produce that I will be growing and eating.

I understand the symbolic gesture part, but does it really make any tangible difference?

In a word, no.

The closer you live to the seed farm, the more tangible the difference will be to you.

I am under the impression that we *can* buy GMO seed as home gardeners. Justaguy says that only agribusiness can do this. Can anyone share their knowledge on this?

Patty,

To clarify, it isn't that a home gardener can't purchase genetically modified seeds, it is simply that they aren't typically offered. The GMO seeds are for large scale crops that home gardeners aren't likely to even want to grow in their garden such as soybeans or cotton. *Could* we buy the GMO seeds? I suppose, but don't really know.

If you buy cucumber, tomato, pepper or most any other seed, it is not going to be GMO as nobody is offering GMO seeds for these.

In a sense there is GMO corn available, but it's modified for sweetness, not built in pesticides and isn't normally considered GMO.

When you visit a seed vendor who says they don't offer GMO seed, it really isn't saying much since none of the major seed vendors like Burpee, Johnny's etc. are.

That would be like if I market a new line of garden tools and advertised them as "our tools contain no depleted uranium".

It is just fearmongering. Nobody is selling GMO seed for garden use. So if an organic seed company says our seeds are not GMO, it is not factually a lie but it is nevertheless a spurious claim. They are creating unfounded fears then playing off those fears to turn a profit.

Some seed companies cross the line and actually lie to gardeners.

"If you have decided to start your own organic garden, you must first begin by purchasing vegetable seeds that are certified organic. "

That is patently false.

Personally, we've bought organic seeds when possible, but even in the fairly natural and liberal city where we live, the pickins were slim a few months ago. We often went with Wal-Mart because they seem to specialize in the herbs we love; we've also gotten thsoe seeds that the customers gave back- ones that grew the plants, then were sort of... renewed, then repackaged.

We do have a few organic seeds. I forget which plants they were. We've also bought organic plants.

So buy when you can and when they're available- but if there's something that you really want to grow and can't find it organically, get it anyway- that's my opinion. :)

"our tools contain no depleted uranium"

That would make a great sig line.

There actually are some gmo seeds on the market that consumers can buy. According to Fedco ( where I get most my seed) Burpee golden beet is a Gmo? I have been growing that for years not knowing. It's germination and growth rate was slow. I now use detroit golden and golden mangel an heirloom seed.

I cannot imagine that using treated seed has a noticable impact on the soil or the plant it produces. It's a religion, like Mac vs Pc. and organic is the pasword these days. I grow my stuff organically because I get free manure and I like what it does to my otherwise marginal soil. I also don't like handling chemicals and spraying them on the food I eat or give away. I use neam oil for aphids and it works ok, nothing for root maggots, just plant a few extra plants for the bugs etc. I have less than an acre in cultivation so managment is fairly easy. I also grow under various types of mulch, a winner all the way from my way of thinking.

I had the opportunity to chat with a fellow that travels the world resurecting sick forests with proprietary enzymes he has created. He also tests soil and vegitbles with frequency devices he created in his labs to determine health. A healthy vegitable will sit on your kitchen counter for a long time and dehydrate, an imballanced one will rot fairly fast. It was indicated to me that some of the worst vegitable frequencies come from all chemical fertilized and all organically fertilized gardens and the combination of the two fertilezers produced the best produce, for what is is worth. The debate is likely to go on for some time.

There actually are some gmo seeds on the market that consumers can buy. According to Fedco ( where I get most my seed) Burpee golden beet is a Gmo?

Burpee introduced that variety in the 1940s, I really doubt it's GMO. No point to it. Could always ask them if you wanted to know for certain, but I think someone at Fedco spun ya a yarn.