You can most definitely have a successful container garden grown under organic principles but it does take a bit of understanding how to achieve. I grow a wide variety of plants, both edible and ornamental, in containers and have followed organic practices with them for years with great results.

The primary reason you see conflicts in this type of growing situation is because most container mixes/potting soils contain very little in the way of OM to support soil microbes. Compost - the typical source of most microbe enriched OM - is typically not a component in standard container mixes as it continues to decompose and too easily and too rapidly loses its structure, contributing to reduced porosity and poor drainage, both of which are serious problems in container culture. And it is the activities of the soil microbes that are required to convert most organic fertilizers into soluble forms plants can access readily.

So how do you get around this? You incorporate a modest quantity of good quality compost (or better yet, worm castings) into your container mix with the understanding that it should work well for a single growing season before losing structure and needing to be replaced. Or you opt for a high quality organic potting mix that is innoculated with microbes - Gardner & Bloome is a local brand with several excellent potting mix formulations that should be available in your area (or look for other Kellogg soil products, a California organic soil and amendments distributor).

While I always start my container plantings off with some granulated organic fertilizer added to the mix at planting time - EB Stone products are fine; other options are Whitney Farms or Dr. Earth) - this is by nature going to be slow release and you will need to supplement for fast growing crops. Liquid organic fertilizers are water soluble and so bypass the required trip through the digestive system of soil microbes to be effective and are therefore fast acting. Fish or kelp emulsion, compost tea or other prepared organic liquid fertilizers will work fine for this purpose. Dr. Earth makes a concentrated organic liquid fert intended specifically for hanging baskets and containers.

But the hard core container growers seem to insist it can't be done "organically."

What a foolish statement. I have been container growing herbs and tomatoes Organically for years now. Its simple, it all starts with the soil. Mother nature has been doing it for thousands of years (minus the container) without the use of synthetic fertilizers. Its very possible/easy to container grow organically. Simply stop using synthetic fertilizers, fungicides, herbicides, insecticides etc.

You must do some research first about what type of soil each plant species prefers. Im not sure what "Al's mix" is, but Im almost positive it will not apply to all plants, herbs, fruit etc. Citrus for example which grows excellent here in Florida with little human input is grown in loose, well drained sandy soil. Therefor you would not want to container grow a citrus tree in dense/rich soil.

Which leads me to the question: is it just that the organic fertilizers out there won't work WELL (i.e. the plant won't put out to its full "genetic potential" as Al from the container forum would say) or is it that the plants won't fruit at all. Or survive, even.

If you start with healthy soil (The Soil FoodWeb), you will have healthy plants.The Soil Foodweb refers to the collection of micro-organisms and micro-arthropods in the soil that interact directly or indirectly with plants, decompose organic matter, or prey on the organisms that interact with plants.

As for a good amendment/fertilizer I mainly use Alfalfa, Cornmeal, Seaweed and molasses for my container garden. I especially like alfalfa meal or pellets which can be purchased from a Farm/feed store in 50lb bags. After broken down by the soil microbes Alfalfa has an NPK of around 3-1-2 and a high availability of trace minerals. They also contain trianconatol, a natural fatty-acid growth stimulant. I use alfalfa along with other grains to feed my St.augustine lawn, all my landscape plants and palms and my entire container garden. (click on my user name for more info) For a slow release feeding you can mix alfalfa with soil or place them on top of the soil. For a fast release you can make Alfalfa tea, do a search on Garden web for alfalfa tea. I also feed all my plants weekly with seaweed. I use regular Corn meal to keep plants free of disease. Corn meal feeds a fungus called Trichoderma. This Trichoderma feeds off of other fungi and will kill most diseases. Corn meal is also a mild fertilizer.

To answer your question; Yes, you can without a doubt grow organically in containers.

I hope this helps and Im sure many more will chime in.

Here is a link that might be useful: Synthetic Vs. Organic Fertilizers: Can Plants Tell the Difference?

Skoot Kat

I've already tried it and i can tell you that it doesn't work that way. If you'd take your time and head over to Container Forum and read Al's stuff, you'll understand why. Growing plants in the ground and growing plants in the containers are two totally different things as I've found out. Needlessly to say, I don't grow trees in the container organically. I use Al's mix for it. I've read as much as I can everywhere and I understand the principle behind container growing now at least for the trees that need to be in the container for a few years to achieve the desired size. It's different for annual plants though.

Lou

I've never tried to grow trees in containers. I have however successfully grown several different types of herbs and tomatoes in containers with the above methods.

Skoot cat

We're talking about annual vs perennial plants. The issue is the soil collapse. You may not see that in annual plants if you're starting over with the mix. It becomes an issue for plants being in the pots for several years. Bonsai trees grow in mostly inorganic matter. it could be lava sand, granite sand, etc around 1/4-1/3" size. No fine particles at all. No compost. No peat moss I don't think but it tend to vary a bit but the principle behind that type of mix is the same. Fine barks are sometimes included as well. Free draining and very porosity is the key for perennials. It also depends on what you're growing. Some need more water while others need less water. Also the containers are outside and subject to high temperature causing very high microbial growth and break down of organic matter when given organic fertilizer. It is harder to control compared to the ground which is more gradual release of nutrients. That's why controlled release synthetic fertilizer like Dynamite is helpful.

Thanks for the discussion, everyone.

Just to clarify, I am talking about growing dwarf citrus trees and a few blueberry bushes in pots. The mix I'm planning to use is:

--5 parts composted redwood bark
--1 part perlite
--2 parts organic potting soil (the brand is Master Nursery/Gardener's Gold, which I believe is actually a Kellog brand private labeled for the upscale nurseries). It has finely screened, composted fir bark fines, worm castings, real topsoil, redwood peat moss, chicken manure, and sand. and pH balanced with dolomite and oyster shell limes.

It's definitely too dense and rich to plant citrus in long term... but mixed with the composted bark and perlite it should be great. Now if only I could figure out the fertilizer issue.

GARDENGAL, thanks for the advice. Like you said, compost breaks down after about a year. And since I'm planting citrus and don't want to repot EVERY year, could I top-dress with a good compost couple times a year?

LOU, what do YOU use for your trees in pots?

thanks!

My main purpose is to grow trees till they reach the desired size before planting out so I don't spend too much money on the mix. It's more in line of Al's mix. They will be grown in Rootmaker container which is designed to produce superior root system compared to ordinary nursery container which tend to cause terrible root system.

I don't recall the exact measurement but it looks like this

5 parts screen pine bark fines
1 part turface (or others)
1 part peat
Controlled release fertlizer like dynamite
Dolomite lime

I plan on using seaweed liquid and alfalfa tea every once in a while.

kristimama, I am familiar with the Master Nursery products (yes, they are formulated and distributed by Kellogg) and there is enough organic material in your Gardener's Gold soil mix to maintain viable populations of soil microbes. So yes, any organic fertilizer you wish to use will work. Because the granulated forms are insoluble and will be slow acting, I would seriously consider supplementing with a dilute liguid organic fert of your choosing. Any better garden center in your area should carry a decent selection or you can concoct your own.

This is a very similar program to what I am doing and have done for years and the results are great. It IS quite possible to successfully grow organic containers and you already have the basis in hand.

Thanks Gardengal. I'm relieved. I have just spent a small fortune on beautiful 7# sized citruses to put in pots, and then had this fear I couldn't grow fruit without a synthetic fertilizer.

But I'm glad I went through this fact finding mission BEFORE potting them (hope to this weekend) because I may actually decide to adjust my mix to include a little bit more of the Gardener's Gold potting mix to the ratio that Al/Tapla recommends over on the container board.

I have a great nursery here in town, so I can probably find a good liquid fert. But if you have any more words of wisdom, favorite brands, feeding schedule, or whatever, it's all much appreciated.

It's been years since I have dealt with fish emulsion. Does that stuff still stink to high heaven, or have they figured out a way to sell a version that is less awful than I remember? ;-)

Thanks again!

I always want to agree with gardengal but I seldom do. This time I DO! I had a Meyer lemon in a pot for years and finally pulled it out this past fall. When we got the tree it was blooming and had been cared for with synthetic palm tree fertilizer (I knew the former owner). I pretty much ignored it until 2002 when I went organic with everything. At first I only used corn meal on it. When I finally applied alfalfa, the tree grew 6 inches in every direction within 30 days. I think the tree/soil combination had a lot of pent up energy that was released with the alfalfa. I gave it a heaping handful of either corn or alfalfa every month that I remembered. That was probably about 6 times a year. We always got hundreds of blooms and about 6-12 fruit.

Growing a citrus in a pot is hard because they like more of a consistent moisture level than I was able to keep up with. My schedule takes me away from home for weeks at a time, so it had to go into the ground.

I also had 15 African violets that I kept organically. I got them for $0.50 each from Wal-Mart long after the season. They were outside in winter being watered daily. Needless to say they were in awful shape. Three died almost before I got them home but the other 12 recovered nicely. Two of them bloomed but again, my job changed and I was not able to pay attention to them. But I was able to do things to them that the African violet mafia would cringe at. Well, they would have simply passed up anything from Wal-Mart to begin with, but it made a great experiment for organics. My conclusion after that experiment was that by fertilizing with milk, the violets became bullet proof. They never got a fungal disease, leaves did not drop from stress, leaves did not discolor from water spots, or any of the other common violet problems.

DCHALL - tell me about your milk fertilizer for your african violets. I've lost mine last summer, not sure what happened. Do you just use straight cow's milk or do you dilute? Please enlighten.

Gardengal,
you mentioned a Dr. Earth liquid organic. Are you referring to the 3-3-3 liquid? I just bought some and am going to use it this weekend. It's been about a month since I potted with some EB Stones, and it's probably time.

Wow. this is very enlightening! I've been mixing top soil with manure / humus, sometime peat moss and some chicken poop (cock-a-doodle-doo!) for all my tomato and herb containers. Every year I add more of the same mix to the same container and my tomatoes & herbs have done pretty well. But I am not comfortable using using Cock-a-doodle-doo - worried about e-coli etc. I like the idea of alfalfa and seaweed. Would they be available in any local nursery? I have agway and Home depot and Lowes in the neighborhood.
I also bought a bottle of terracycle (worm poop) - http://www.terracycle.net - but it is kind of expensive (At home depot at least)