pkguy: If it is of any help... I have narrowed my list down to... - Lawn-Boy Platinum #10797 - Honda HRX217HXA The above are the only mowers that I have found in my local area that have... - Blade brake/clutch... which is essential to me when it comes to leaves/needles in the fall. As re starting the engine 25+ times every time I bag leaves/needles in my yard is such a nuisance to me. - Over head valve engine... I think this is the best bet since it is more efficient... which for me means I will get good performance out of it and it will be better for the environment pollution and fuel consumption wise. The two mowers above have Honda OHV engines... which I feel is a plus as well. I took a look at the Toro SR4 today... nice mower, well built, rolls well with bushings in wheels, sold by knowledgeable dealer with good local reputation. The way the bag attaches and detaches is solid once on... two metal hooks that latch around a steel bar. The hooks weren't as easy to hook in as the way the Honda bag went on (see below). The personal pace thing... looks solid to me and for me isn't a real plus or minus either way. But the engine on the Toro not being a side valve/lhv takes it off my list. You can get a Toro SR4 with a OHV... but it doesn't have a blade brake/clutch I also took a look at the Honda HRX217HXA today. I really liked the versa-mow selector for mulch/bag. I thought it would be a plus for leaves/needles... as you could set the lever in between and mulch/bag. I also liked how the bag attached/detached... sturdy and easy to do by feel - meaning you wouldn't have to look down or work at attaching it. The bag attach/detach was better on the Honda then on the Toro. Granted the slots on the Honda were solid/solid plastic where on the Toro they were metal. The bag frame on both the Honda and Toro were metal. The only things I am not sure of on the Honda after seeing it... the strength of the blade brake/clutch lever (seemed real plasticy in terms of the lever on the handle). The overall design of the deck... doesn't look like there is much room under it for the grass to circulate. Heard some comments from local dealers how Honda engines are solid but the mowers themselves aren't the best. The exterior of the transmission box looked pretty chincy... although it is inside of the box that counts. The wheels didn't roll or feel as solid as on the Honda as they did on the Toro. I haven't gotten to look at the Lawn-Boy in person yet... the two dealers in my local area don't have their shipment in yet (we still have some snow on the ground). My hope is the Lawn-Boy will take what I like on the Toro and spruce it up a bit. Specifically, the pictures of the Lawn-Boy show how easily the bag attached and detaches. From the pictures it looks similar to the way the Honda bag attaches/detaches... except that you don't have to mess with the hinged plastic cover. By the way... Ariens and Snapper don't have a blade brake/clutch. The Ariens SW21 is a solid piece of machinery in terms of how it is built... has a Kawasaki engine which is a plus to. The Ariens didn't have the blade brake/clutch feature... which takes it off my list. Besides... the Ariens dealer in my area is a Deere dealer... and his prices are full/full retail and their service rates are much higher then anyone else in the area (that's Deere for you). Troy-Bilt did or does (not sure)... but it has lots of issues according to the service guys. Besides... Troy-Bil is part of MTD and most if not all of their consumer mowers are total junk... throw away type mowers sold only at big box stores (not all of them... but the vast majority). The Toro blade brake/clutch is solid and performs well... as does the one on the Honda. Anyways... more then you probably wanted to know. But figured the info might come in handy to someone. -------------------------------------------------------- * Posted by pkguy (My Page) on Mon, Apr 9, 07 at 17:09 Like Easternupstate I'm also in the market and have looked at the Toro's LB's, MTD, Sears,other makes and Ariens. I just got back from Ariens today and they're carrying a new design lineup called Blade Runner along with their traditional looking deck models, all to add to the confusion. I've also got tons of leaves from 8 giant oak trees in the back yard along with all the associated twigs etc that fall off. The bags on the Arien LM21S are pretty easy to dump, on the new Blade Runners, not so easy because they have the attached bag cover, I think the LB's have the easiest with that fold away handle. Anyways, I'm still looking. Heck I'm spending more time deciding on a lawnmower than I would for a new car LOL

I agree with s-tre. I just bought a 20066 Toro Personal Pace last Sunday at Home Depot. Good price... $349, which is about 20 dollars off the list. Just tried it out today and I was a little disappointed the first time out. Maybe I just miss my old Snapper 6 speed bail bar mower, I don't know. But S-Tre is correct, bumps or roots will cause a small jolt, and a choppy motion forward because of imperfections in the yard, but not too bad. It is hard to keep momentum on turns also, going around small circles you end up pushing with short back and forward motions. The mower does cut very well, although the bag dumps a lot of clippings when you pull it off to empty. Now here is my real issue. With this thick St. Augustine grass we have in Florida (Floratam), the personal pace is a pain in my back. There is a slight pressure you need to maintain pushing your arms down while your legs move you forward. In this tall thick grass, and it does strain your middle back if you're used to a mower pulling you along. I know you folks in Nebraska are thinking what a wimp, but it's true you guys up there have that thin short stuff, this lawn is so deep and thick you can loose a small dog in it. If there were a way to adjust the sensitivity on the personal pace drive train this may still be a good mower for Florida. I am seriously thinking of returning this for a variable speed bail bar mower.

An HRB216TDA still running? Wow. I had one which was a pretty good mower but sold it because the cutting height only went to 3". I was only using it in the spring and fall, using a Lawn-Boy 10550 in the summer when I needed 3.5". I eventually got rid of that one too and now have two boringly dependable LB 4-cycle mowers that can cut up to 4". I sold that Honda to a guy starting a lawn care business. Come to think of it, mine was starting to drag on the pull-back too. The 3-speed shifter was poor, not having a good detent at each speed setting. I eventually gave up and just left it in 2. 3 was good for finishing up with a thunderstorm coming - it was almost a run - definitely a fast walk. Other than that, it leaked oil constantly when running around the governor shaft - enough so that the wood floor in my shed still has a big oil stain from it. Well, it also has another one from where the LB 10550 float stuck and drained the gas tank after I parked it. Most Honda OHC engines leak around the governor shaft but it's just a nuisance that you wash off twice a year. Look underneath the mower and inside the belt tunnel to make sure all old clippings are cleaned from the drive mechanisms. You might also let some light lube drip down into the cable housing and lube the wire bail ends. Cleaning and lubing the ratchets/clutches will fix the pull-back as already posted.

Basically any good grease, but I like to stay on the lighter side. Those axle-end gears/ratchets have to be cleaned and lubed yearly. You can use the spray can of white lithium grease sold most places, even Wal Mart. Use the straw that comes with it and really dope it up. The HRR216 is a nice mower. I just finished re-habbing my stepson's. I put new wheels on, including the new-style front wheels with ball bearings, a new blade set, spark plug, changed oil and air filter, cleaned/lubed the rear end and got him a mulch plug and side discharge chute. They got it from his wife's mom who gave up housekeeping and all it had was a bag, no plug or chute. Plus, a general cleaning/fixing-up. It has some hours on it but runs fine. I still don't think it's going to be around but a few more years. Grass had been allowed to build up and the discharge port housing is very close to being rusted out. The job I did on it would have cost way more than its worth at a shop, but when I take it over there I'll just say 'Happy Father's Day'! BTW, I found a really good mower cleaner - car wheel cleaner! Safe for aluminum, painted surfaces and polymers. Wet down mower, spray the cleaner on, use a soft-bristle brush all over, hose off - you're done.