tapla, >These all present the potential for difficulty or disaster.What did that mean? Driving a car presents potential difficulties or disasters too, but, if someone wants to warn against such problems, they usually do so by explaining themselves. >This is untrue. Nicotine is a known carcinogen, but is not phytotoxic to any noticeable degree. Nicotine insecticides have been used for years, and before I knew better, I used tobacco tea with no evidence of plant damage.Not big on reading what I was responding to, huh? The question was if CIGARETTE BUTTS should be used as FILLER. 1.) Cigarette butts and Nicotine insecticides are two different things! 2.) Nicotine isnt a carcinogen at all; the poisons (phytotoxics  I can use big words, too, just see no need when "poison" is easier to spell. LOL) are other substances in the cigarette and the derivative from the nicotine, which become even more potent, once smokers draw them all into the filter as we finish the smoke - once again making it a crappy filler for gardening! 3.) Nicotine Insecticide is a 40% solution of nicotine, not butts! As for the harm of such exposure of the insecticide, while the nicotine does degrade quickly, it is still an insecticide, able to harm the gardener just by going through the skin. (http://www.moleculeoftheday.com/2006/06/21/nicotine-freebasing-insecticide & http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/chemical/nicotine.htm#PartTitle:9.%20CLINICAL%20EFFECTS ) Then again, the carcinogens in the butts DO poison people, animals, plants, and the ground. 4.) If it caused no problems, why do you "know better now?" (Then again, why is it you're allowed to learn as you go, but obviously, we are to KNOW all of this stuff immediately?) >Oh, and for the record -- there is no such thing as a plant being kept in the same pot long term, if you want to keep your plants health in containers This is also just not true. With a little knowledge of repotting, root and regular pruning techniques, even herbaceous plantings can be kept in the same containers indefinitely.Again, this just makes you look silly and snotty. Had you read the WHOLE paragraph, your response was needless. YouÂve said nothing different then what I said. >There's more that I disagree with, but there's not much sense in going over it now.Well, so far the only thing IÂve seen you disagree with, that I actually WROTE, was about some of the fillers IÂve used. Nothing written why they were a bad idea to begin with, so even that was useless. As for the rest of the "disagreements," I can agree that you are very disagreeable, just disagreeing on something that I didnÂt write, or disagreeing by agreeing with me! A waste of ire! I almost expected to be disagreed with, yet assumed there would actually be rational reasoning behind it. I have no problem with disagreement, but assume that the person disagreeing would explain why?! Unlike you, I gave the best help I could offer, and actually took my time to respond thoroughly. Meanwhile, you merely pooh-poohed me with no facts included, no reasoning at all, and obviously little reading involved on your part! There wasnÂt any reason to go at all, since you contributed nothing to the thread, except to show you're disagreeable. As for everyone participating on this thread -- thank you. I've learned more too. I have used all the fillers I've mentioned last year, and like tapla, I've seen no problems with my plants by doing so. After having to sift my soil away from the peanuts used last year, the only thing I've added to my method, is to put a layer of shredded paper between the soil and peanuts, in hope that the peanuts don't stick in the soil again next year. If that doesn't work, the only thing I'll ever use Styrafoam for again, is to surround the planters during winter for insulation (putting them in contractor bags wrapped around the containers.) I have learned that they do not flatten over the gardening season. Also, unflattened soda cans with the opening faced down IS a better idea then flattening them, (Read that in a book, and have done it myself.) Don't know if that gives you any more useful info, or not. Just wanted to make sure, I'm not angry with anyone else on this thread, and thought it was a good thread, in general! Lynn

Here is some general information for you from the International Fertilizer Institute: Preferably based on soil tests. If pH is low and liming is recommended, limestone should be broadcast and turned into the soil in early spring. Most USA research indicates no response to N when the soil is limed to an adequate pH and inoculated with the correct Rhizobium sp. On the other hand, many responses to N have been obtained in other countries. Few responses to P and K have been recorded in USA since the rotational crops usually have higher requirements. Responses have been reported, however, under very low fertility conditions in Africa and in particular in soils with high P fixation. Basal applications of P and K (and of N too in several countries) are usually broadcast and incorporated into the soil before planting. Some topdressings of small amounts of N are applied at the vegetative stage in China. Gypsum application (to supply Ca and S), by broadcasting or banding at flowering, is common. B and Mo are commonly applied in foliar sprays at the vegetative stage. Present fertilizer practices USA Limestone broadcast and turned into the soil before planting if pH Gypsum applied at bloom to small-seeded types, when Mehlich 1 extractable Ca Boron at 0.6 kg/ha B (unless soil level > 0.5 mg/kg B) usually in foliar sprays, split between the first two fungicide applications.

I am going to agree with bpgreen, there is too little salt to make any difference. Even if I were in Utah I wouldn't worry about it. Look at all the people on this site who talk about using seaweed to make compost, they are dealing with thousands of times the salt you are talking about and seem to ge by just fine. As a technical note by "salt" you are refering to soduium salt. Sodium is bad in that it is toxic. There are many other salts such as potassium sulfate, ammonium nitrate etc that are sold as fertilizers and supply nutrients to plants. But too much of a good thing can be trouble and that is what happens with too much fertilizer, the plants bet "burned."

They have about the same fertility requirements as common beans, just ahve a much longer maturity date. They don't like clay, so that may be your greater problem. But typically in a heavier soil, fertilizer incorporated in the planting bed is sufficient. In sandy soils, a side dressing is usful just before they start to bloom, some thing light in N and heavy in phoshate.