"Insecticidal Soap sprayed directly on a beneficial such as a bee, Lady Beetle and its larva, etc. can be as harmful to them as it is to any other insect. Insecticidal Soaps can be used to aid in control of Japanese Beetles, if sprayed in the morning before they become active." Sorry, but that is simply not true. Insecticidal soaps are not considered broad spectrum insecticides because they only target soft bodied insects. They have a well-established reputation for being virtually harmless to beneficial insects. They have no impact on anything with an exoskeleton. From CO State: "Insecticidal soaps are considered selective insecticides because of their minimal adverse effects on other organisms. Lady beetles, green lacewings, pollinating bees and most other beneficial insects are not very susceptible to soap sprays." From an organic gardening site: "The insects must come into direct contact with the spray droplets for the material to be effective. Good coverage is essential. It does not kill beneficial insects such as ladybugs, praying mantis and others. Note: Some entomologists have concerns about impact of soaps on soft-bodied immature predators, such as lady beetle and lacewing larvae. No real data has turned up that substantiates these fears, however, until such data surfaces, perhaps refraining from using soaps where there are numbers of these beneficial larvae (until they mature) would be advisable." From WSU extension service: "Many of the beneficial insects in gardens are not harmed by soaps. Bees, wasps and adult beetles are not affected. Sometimes, however, the larval stage of beneficial insects may be killed." And from Clemson University: " Insecticidal soaps have many advantages when compared to other insecticides. They are inexpensive to use, are among the safest pesticides, leave no harsh residue, are natural products that are virtually non-toxic to animals and birds, and can be used on vegetables up to harvest. Most beneficial insects are not harmed by soap sprays."

Information that has been written about here before, but is always good to review. The article does list some materials that are no longer acceptable to organic growers. Here is a link that might be useful: pesticides and bees

eahamel, there was a time when plants were the only source of all medicines, drugs etc. Over the years extraction and concentration methods have enabled the exploitation of useful products into "-cides" (insecti-, miti-, nemati-, etc.) In my own lifetime I have seen the leaves of the Neem tree (Azadirachta indica) used as a repellent against weevils in stored grain and as a relief from measles. (They made us sleep on a bed of Neem leaves when we had the condition). I have seen it eaten as a salad but it was too bitter for me. It was not a surprise to me when Margosan-O⢠was marketed as an insecticide and deer repellent. I have been overwhelmed by perfume in an elevator and I can understand a mosquito's avoidance of citronella oil.

Toxicity is a measure of how detrimental a substance is to something. All pesticides are toxic to the wee critters they are meant to control and may be, in varying degrees toxic to animals and humans as well. Since Insecticidal Soaps do kill some insects they are toxic to those insects. Pyrethrins are toxic to more insects a broader spectrum of them and includes many beneficial insects. Toxicity is relative and the dose that kills an insect may not do much harm to a human while others have been found to be toxic to humans in fairly small doses. Many of the substances we use today are being found in our drinking water, Nitrates, from high Nitrogen fertilizers, in our drinking water is one of many and some believe those come from "farms" while many homeowners contribute by applying to much fertilizer. Neem is toxic to some insects but is not, in normal amounts used, toxic to humans and has been used in India for centuries by humans for many things including tooth cleaning. A basic premise of organic growing is that plants growing in a good healthy soil will be less susceptible to attack and harm from insect pests and plant diseases so the soil plants are growing in is the most important part of the garden to an organic grower. Then an organic grower may take actions that limit the need for using pesticides, using plant protectors (Floating Row Covers, inter cropping, etc.), not growing plants that are very susceptible to insect pest attack. kimmq is kimmsr