One thing that will leach the nutrients out of soil is too frequent watering-its hard to say if that is the problem though.

Chemical fertilizers are better for potted plants. Most potting soil does not have enough of the microorganisms needed to break down organic fertilizers into the chemical fertilizers the plant actually uses.

First let me say I'm REALLY sorry to hear that things aren't going well. I know it can really be frustrating and disappointing when our plants don't perform like we hoped they would.

It may or may not be the fertilizer. It might have something to do with how it was applied. It could also be any one of a pretty fair number of other possibilities - like over-watering, a nutrient deficiency, or a disease or pest infestation.

How about starting by telling us what kind of MG you were using before the new stuff - what was the NPK and how often did you use it and at what solution strength? When you watered, did you water until quite a bit of water came out of the drain hole(s)? Can you be sure you weren't over-watering?

Al

It is very possible that it was caused by overwatering. It has been getting hot and I didn't want the plant to dry out. It has drainage holes on the bottom of the pot so I figured that excess water would just seep out. That also means that the plant was sitting in a puddle of excess water.

I was originally using Miracle Gro Tomato Plant Food (18-18-21) once a week, but then switched to Miracle Gro All Purpose Plant Food every other week. I'd add a scoop (the large end of the scooper) to 2 gallons of water. Everything looked great, even with the possible overwatering. Now, since finding out that it's chemical-based, I switched to the organic one (8-0-0) and it all fell apart!

I put organic compost on top of the plants in hopes that it might help. My boyfriend thinks I need to fertilize with the chemical based one but I don't know if that will hurt or help.

Another thing I noticed is that the soil seems compacted. When I water them, the water sort of sits at the top and then seeps down. Also, I tried to take some soil at soil level to test it, but there were too many roots all spread loosely. I scooped out a bit to test but it was loaded with roots. Could this all be related to the problem?

Thanks for the help so far!!!

I should have asked you to describe your soil, too - maybe the brand or how you made it - if you mixed anything into it before potting your plants.

It sounds like you'll need a fair measure of hope to get things back on track. You can decide for yourself between the organic/inorganic fertilizer thing, but I'll say that I use nothing but soluble fertilizers on my containerized plants. The forum has a LOT of pictures of my plants, so you can be assured that the soluble fertilizers work very well, and I'll even say much better than organic soil amendments for container culture. Plants don't care where their nutrients come from. In the end, plants take up exactly the same salts as building blocks for growth, whether they come from breaking down organic matter or from a box - they're all the same elements in the end.

I think the two things you need to concentrate on are getting the watering under control and perhaps deciding on what you're going to do about nutrition. If the leaves are getting crispy, it's probably a result of N burn from directly applying N to the foliage (just a guess because the damage came on the heels of that application). I'm reluctant to tell you to rinse the foliage thoroughly, but if you haven't already, do it late in the morning. If your leaves are evenly yellow, but a little more pronounced in older plants, I'd guess you need to apply fertilizer. I'd encourage you to use the 24-8-16 you have, but that's up to you. Forget about foliar pathways for nutrients. Rely on the roots only to absorb nutrients.

I'm not sure what will happen. I wish I could SEE what's going on to get a better feel, but .......

Good luck - don't be shy about asking questions.

Al

I believe I was using the Sta-Green Flower & Vegetable Planting Mix. I did not add anything to the tomato plant doing the worst and only added organic compost to the other tomato plants and the potato plant. It seems I should have just stuck with the chemical fertilizer which was working so well.

I used much less water today and put some organic compost on top of the soil last night. The yellowing has slowed down significantly. I haven't rinsed the leaves but will do so tomorrow morning. It doesn't look like nitrogen burn but does very much look like nitrogen deficiency.

Is there any possibility that this could be fusarium wilt?

Oh, and I also noticed that two tomoatoes (on separate plants) have small brown spots on them towards the blossom end. Could that be a separate problem or related the yellowing of the plant?

Thanks again for your help. I put so much effort into these plants. Everyone was saying how wonderful they looked and now this happens. I'm not ready to give up without a huge fight though!

Was the 'organic compost' your own or something from a bag?

One of the wilts, blight, botrytis are all possibilities, but they usually have leaves turning crispy quickly.

The BER (blossom end rot) is probably from a lack of Ca, but it could easily be culturally induced (by too much water impairing the plants ability to absorb enough Ca to satisfy the plant's requirements) especially id the weather has been cloudy and/or humid. Did you happen to note if the soil you used contained lime?

Repeating - I would fertilize with a half recommended strength of the 24-8-16, then RESIST the urge to water until you actually observe the plant starting to wilt. Take note of how long the plant was able to go before it wilted and use that as a baseline to determine your watering intervals - if it was 4 days, you know your watering interval will be about every 3 days for a while, until the planting increases in mass & needs more water. If the plant responds favorably to the fertilizer, hit it again with another half dose soon after the first, then try a half dose weekly or a full dose every other week. If you get your plants back on track, we can talk about something with a little less N for your tomatoes.

I really hope all works out for you, SD. Best luck!

Al

The organic fertilizer was bought in a bag from a nursery. That is a great idea about the watering, thank you! I always water every morning but lately I have been watering a lot more due to the increase in temperature. I will refrain now as I do think I'm doing harm with too much water.

I went outside to check the soil that I used and it does not mention lime so I assume it does not have any.

Also, I noticed two tomatoes on the worst plant have blossom end rot. I removed them from the plant. I assume that is either from my overwatering or damage to too many feeder roots. I scraped the top of the soil yesterday to be able to test it, but it also scraped up a lot of roots with it, which I assume are feeder roots that are extremely close to soil level. I'm really starting to see that my overwatering quite possibly leached the soil of nutrients. Ugh.

Over-watering might have caused leaching if you were watering to the point where the soil was totally saturated and lots of water was escaping the drain hole; otherwise, most of the nutrients remain in the soil & get used up.

Did it say anything about the soil being pH adjusted on the package? If not, you probably need to take steps to ensure your plants are getting adequate Ca (to ward off the BER) & Mg, because the MG has neither.

Al

"Sta-Green Flower & Vegetable Planting Mix"

This is part of your problem. Look for a "potting mix" not "planting mix" on the bag for next time.

He's right. A quick search shows that particular soil is designed to be used in the garden or beds, not in containers. We're on the right track thinking compaction and over-watering is at the heart of the issue, but it's pretty certain you'll be fighting the soil for the whole growing season. :-(

Al

I agree about the soil, but I didn't know better when I bought it and everything was perfect until now. The two major things that happened right before this happened is I used the organic plant food concentrate and the soil dried out. I usually water in the morning but didn't get to watering until around noon. The leaves looked wilted when I went to water. Is it possible that the plant food or drying out would cause such quick damage?

One of the tomatoes I pulled earlier today was definitely suffering from blossom end rot. The second one didn't look the same. The first one had that darkening flat area at the blossom end, but the second one had a dark ope,n sunken area in the middle of the fruit. Can that be a sign of blossom end rot as well? Could Fusarium crown and root rot or even fusarim wilt be the cause? Ive been doing so much reading and still can't figure out what went wrong and why.

In any case, what can I do to improve this situation? Upon examining the tomatoes, I noticed several have the little dark spots towards the bottom. Is it hopeless for them? They only have one or a few dark little spots. Will the spots keep growing in size or is there a way I can stop it before it destroys the tomato? Also, the newer tomatoes don't have any spots and look good so far. Should I buy some kind of lime to increase the calcium?

Upon further examination of the plants, I also noticed small dark spots on some leaves. *sigh*

--Maggie

Its only June. You would be fighting problems now till fall if you stay with the wrong mix for the pots.

You should re-pot, my opinion. (There is a certain way to do this correctly with the situation you are in)

I have re-potted everything as I have learned things this year; it really helps having the right pot and right mix. Other-wise you will probably have marginal success to possible failure with more time than it takes to re-pot..

Once I got the hang of it, I could repot about 6 per hour including mixing soil, bare rooting, all the things you might need to do. A second set of hands and a plan will be helpful.

Al will help you come up with a plan & figure out whats best for you. He is very good.

I use Pine Bark fines, "Sta Green POTTING mix with moisture control" and Perlite, 3:1:1 in grocery store 99cent cloth bags. Should be 4 or 5 to one instead of 3, but its working pretty good.

Container fertilizer is also critical to understand. Miracle Grow is not bad, but, you have to use the right one, at the right dilution at the right frequency, as with all container fertilizers.

good luck

d

Do you feel as though your plants are worth repotting? I'm asking that in a kind way - asking you to make the assessment.

Al

I have definitely thought of repotting and I will definitely do it if that is what is needed to save the plant. I'm getting a soil tester tomorrow to give me a better idea of what is going on.

If I need to repot, I will need to know how to do it. The plants are all tall and mostly laden with unripe tomatoes. I don't want to damage the roots or the plant or especially any of the tomatoes that aren't showing sign of disease yet. The plants are in large plastic pots and are very heavy! I can get help lifting them though.

This morning I also noticed aphids and spots on the stems from the aphids sucking on the sap. I also noticed what I belive to be spider mites. UGH!! I don't know why these plants are plagued with so many things! It's in a container on my terrace, which I thought would not help not cause so many problems.

Anyway, this morning I put my finger in the soil and it was still moist so I did not water them. One or two more leaves are yellowing, but nothing significant and no further damage to tomatoes that I can see.

Thanks again for all the help!!

Maggie - you have soo many issues going on, that it might be better if you more or less abandoned these particular plants. Transplanting and trying to save them when they are already too weakened to resist insects and diseases might well be throwing good money (time & effort, too) after bad. You'd need to remove all or nearly all the soil from the roots, which will create additional stress on top of what's going on now. If the plants are tall & have fruit, it will be even more difficult to transplant w/o breaking stems & damaging fruit; but if you're up for it .......?

I'm wondering if you couldn't find some single plants at a greenhouse that already have fruit (like patio tomatoes) that you could slip into a larger pot & work with? Does repotting appear feasible to you? I'd hate for you to go through all the effort to find your work didn't do what you hoped. Can you send pics?

Al

I agree with Al not to transplant. I would check the container mix as you did before you water. A better way of checking you mix is push away the compost, if you are still using it as a mulch and put you hand into the mix and pull a handful out. Next squeeze the mix and if water comes out then don't water. This means your soil is still over saturated. The squeeze test should leave a water outline in your palm or glove. This means you are within the water capacity of your mix and still, don't water. If the squeez test leaves a very little water outline, water. I never use a moisture meter because they are so unreliable. Whatch your plants and soil, they will let you know when it's time to water. I hope this helps.

I read your comments and have had the same thing happen to my tomatoes, specifically, aphids and mites - plant laden with fruits. THis is what I did with help from someone. I wrapped the pot with a plastic garbage bag, twising the opening securely around so that no water can enter. Then I laid the plant on its side on top of another plastic garbage bag. Then I used my hose to spray a steady firm sprinkle of water on all the leaves, stem and fruits, blasting off the critters. Esp the undersides. Left it on its side and inspected all the leaves, pouring more water when I found a critter. All this time protecting the opening of the bag around the pot, so that no water floods the soil, (esp in your case) I do this quite often, because the little ones are disgustingly hard to get rid of, but eventually they are killed off.
Just my two cents worth. And BTW, I used the MG Tomato fert -18/18/21 and it works with my container tomatoes.

Have you posted on the 'Growing Tomatoes' forum? I would post a few pictures and see what they say. Sounds like insect/disease or maybe fertilizer damage. I use Miracle Grow without any problems. Is it possible you used too much?

I wouldn't bother repotting at this point.

Good luck,
Jane