suckers are an exact piece of what it is taken off of... YOU KNOW WHAT IT IS ... and WHAT IT WILL BE ... a seedlings is a dna cross between two parents [or one if selfed] ... in theory you have no clue what it will be ... unless a specified cross is made.. and a known results comes from said cross ... it may be hardy.. it may be vigorous... it may be white.. it may be purple ... some might knock your socks off with stink ... and others nearly no smell ... lots of variables ... could be a decade wasted on growing something you end up not liking ... getting a sucker from a mother plant.. that you have seen in a friends garden.. see it.. feel it ... know its potential ... that IS WHAT I WOULD RECOMMEND ... know what you are getting into ... the seedling thing sounds more like a soil conservation plan.. where you might not really care about the perfection of any given plant .... simple enough.. or should i try again??? when they are in bloom.. in your area ... just shop around .... find a great one.. in a nice garden... bet a buck you can talk just about any gardener out of one of the hundred suckers on a big plant .... trade them for a batch of cookies or something ... SEE WHAT YOU ARE GETTING ... ken

Both have to be a suckering type. Many lilacs are now sold that do not sucker and there is not much you can do to make them do so. The common lilac types will sucker with impunity and there would be no need to remove the grass/sod. Do you know what kind of roses and lilacs you have? I would not use a vegetation killer so close to the shrubs. Too much chance of injury to the 'good guys'. Could try digging out the sod around them, replacing the sod with a good soil and then mulch lightly with grass clippings or whatever you happen to have. If the lilacs are not the suckering kind, try to propogate them by bending a lower branch down and anchoring it firmly in the soil. Water it occasionally. It will root and next year you can separate it from the main plant. Jan

A couple of years ago my brother and I had the opportunity to get some "old growth" lilacs. How it happened was that I came home for lunch and the nieghbor had pulled out plants that were at least 30 years old and had just left them laying in the front yard to haul off later. I of course asked and recieved them. What I did was take large garbage cans (55gal size) plopped the plants in and then filled with water. This happened in August in Central Oregon, I was amazed at how quickly they sprang back and thrived, I left them in the water for about two weeks then planted. My brother did the same and we probably got close to 20 7-10 foot plants out of this deal. Mine at this time are all blooming beautifully. So I would guess that they would do fine. I've given many shoots away through the years.

I'm growing Sarah's Old-fashioned Black and Cherokee Trail of Tears too - in UK. If I'd realised how similar they are I would have kept more careful notes of the different growth patterns etc. I'm picking them dried at the moment. The pods of Sarah's dry lighter in colour here - Sarah's on the right and Cherokee on the left in the photo. The dried beans themselves are very similar size and colour here but the Sarah's are perhaps a little fatter and more torpedo shape and the Cherokee a little flatter. Sorry the seed photo isn't better quality. I think Cherokee is perhaps more prolific but I grew them in different circumstances so I'm not sure. It was great to find someone else is comparing these two beans. I wonder what the parentage is way back!