Tips for growing veggies in containers in a desert

10 years ago

I'm planning out my summer garden and trying some new things this year, so I'd love to get some advice from you all. I apologize that this will be long, but I'm trying to present everything here, rather than asking questions in multiple threads.

I've run out of in-ground gardening space, and would like to expand into containers. So far, I'm hoping to do poblano peppers in 5 gallon buckets and indeterminate tomatoes in 20 gallon storage tubs. I've read about the 511 mix, but because of the extra time and energy to find all the supplies, screen them correctly, and mix up a big batch, I'm considering that a last resort. If I can put in less effort, using bagged potting mixes with some amendments, and still get decent production, I'll be very happy. So far, I know not to get potting soil, or Miracle Grow Moisture Control.

I live in Riverside CA, where we don't get summer rain and temperatures exceed 90F for basically all of July, Aug & Sept. The extreme aridity and intense sun are making me nervous about container gardening.
If I need 50 gallons of growing media for two 5gal buckets and two 20gal tubs, that's ~7 ft3. Last year, I bought a bulk "Planting Mix" from a local nursery to build a raised bed, and it did very well. I've attached a picture of the dry mix, but based on what I've read here, it's probably not suitable for containers - too much 'dirt'.

Right now, my options seem to be:
Sunshine Mix #1 - $33. This comes in a 3.8 ft3 compressed bale, which I'm guessing should expand to almost enough volume. (I can also get Mixes #2-5, but don't know price.)
Sta-Green Potting Mix or Kelloggs Patio Plus Potting Mix - bagged at Lowes - probably around $30 for the total volume I need.
The Sunshine Mix is mostly peat based, with perlite and some fertilizers. The other two Potting Mixes are made of "composted forest products".
Generally speaking, I know that the advantage of the 511 is that it doesn't compact, doesn't retain excess water, and provides air to the roots, which makes the plant very happy. Given that I'm in a very hot, dry climate, though, I'm ok with sacrificing some of the plant's "potential" for the convenience of not having to water twice a day every day. I looked at Lowes and a local nursery, but haven't been able to find suitable bark fines yet, although I have seen perlite and I can continue searching for the bark if you think it's necessary.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to which media would work best in my conditions?

I'd also love some general container-growing advice. So far, I've heard about the following:
- Shade the pots with cardboard or wrap with white fabric to reduce the soil temperature
- Cover the foliage with shade cloth during summer heat
- Put string or strips of an old t-shirt through the bottom holes to allow excess moisture to wick out
- Don't put gravel in the bottom of the pot
- Water until some liquid comes out the bottom of the pot. But I've also read to water from the bottom with a tray. Aren't those exclusive?
- Mulch with straw
For fertilizers, I've read about using Osmocote for long term nutrition supplemented with weekly dilute waterings of MiracleGrow and "micronutrients" - what are micronutrients?
Any other advice for a newbie? Thanks very much.
Chris

Sort by:Oldest

Comments (8)

desert_cat_ca
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I live in Rosamond in the Antelope valley ..Aware of the hot dry conditions..Going to sound crazy..Last year i planted peppers inside a lrg brick i saw this on Pinterest and it grew amazing and i got quite a few peppers..
oxboy555
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
You should be able to find decent bagged products that contain peat, bark, perlite and maybe some compost. It looks like you could just add some perlite in with the stuff in your pic and you'd have a poor-man's 5-1-1.

Are you planning on nursing your tomato plants through summer into fall? Few if any types produce above 90 degree heat and can look really ragged.

THEEE most important thing for any container in a hot dry climate (note I'm from Vegas) is complete afternoon shade during summer. Even though a lot of plants say "Full Sun" or "6+ hours of sun", it doesn't apply to us. Two to four hours of morning sun then they have to be in complete shade from Noon or 1pm on no matter what kind of plant and no matter what kind of container. Else the soil in the pot just gets too warm and roots get cooked. People think watering more (2-3x/day) helps but it actually hastens the plant's demise.

Water from the top until some drains out.

Bark or straw mulch is a good idea.

Google "micronutients" and find a liquid fert like Foliage Pro that contains them all.
Related Discussions
What Container Veggies do you Grow, Pics Too?
Q
Comments (18)
ssmdgardener - Osmocote nutrient release is dependent on temperature. The packaging might say it feeds for three months but the warmer it gets, the faster the fertilizer is released. I go by 2-month cycles. Feeding with something like Foliage-Pro helps fill in between cycles, or just supplement, especially for really heavy feeders like sugarcane and eggplants. To answer your question, you will really benefit from fertilizing anything, including herbs. Leafy herbs, like basils and mints will be more productive. I grow in containers exclusively, though most people on this forum know much more about it, and experimenting with dwarf herbs and vegetables for plant sales at a university. There's a sweet ornamental pepper called Sweet Pickle that produces pretty well in a 1-gallon container. Sweet'n'Neat tomato also does well in the same size pot. Sweet'N'Neat tomato - small and decent producer. Not the best flavor: Ichiban Eggplant produces really well in the proper soil and a healthy dose of soil. Give it an 8-10 gallon pot: This was a Heatwave tomato from three years ago, planted in a mix of 30:70 Worm castings (yes, unorthodox on this forum) and regular potting soil, planted in a 10-gallon container. One tablespoon of Osmocote per gallon of soil would have been more appropriate.
...See More
Container Veggie Garden QUESTIONS - New
Q
Comments (2)
You can't hurt tomatoes planting deeply,the other plants should be planted at same depth as in container. Wait a while before you use miracle-grow,since it is already in mix.Always give transplants a drink of water. Transplant always if possible in early evening,or on a cloudy or rainy day. Also a Very Belated BIRTHDAY!!!!! :)
...See More
Container Vegetable Gardening in Hot / Desert Climate
Q
Comments (6)
Thanks yet again. For some reason I cannot open phoenixpermaulture website. The other two were interesting ones. 1/ Seedlings As for the seedlings, today I took my seedlings on the roof top for the early morning sun for 1 hour and put them inside a plastic sheet (not so clear though - will get a clear one). The temperature then was not more than 75 when I moved them back inside. Right now I have put them on my eastern window - which fortunately or unfortunately does not receive any direct sunlight. Light is fair enough however. Enough to be able to read and write easily. Is the above schedule going to be ok for approx. 3 weeks? What else can I do? or am I doing extra? For how much time the seedlings should be in the dark every day? 2/ Plants I also had bought two small plants (approx 6 inches) - 2 tomatoes and 1 pepper (dont know which variety) and they have been under my care for approx. 2 weeks now. I transplanted them in bigger pots of 14" and 10" respectively. Depending on the temperature and the heat of the sun, I place the plants under 50% shade (my wife helps me as I am usually out for work :) ). This may start from 10 am if it gets to around 90F by that time. While the pepper is going good, I am not particularly happy with the tomato plants, as they seem to be showing signs of yellow leaves - Am I over watering them? Its almost 48 hours since I have not watered them as I can feel moisture beneath 2 inches of soil. While this tells me not to water, but my heart tells me to water them. Today I just did not listened to my heart. I hope this should not be too much stress for the plants :) Previously I use to water at least once a day. But then the pepper plant has not shown any yellow leaves as yet. I haven't fertlized them as yet - I believe the potting soil is fertlized enough to last for a month (that's what the nursery guy told me). To be very frank with you - I am still not able to understand the delicate balance between under and over watering. I was advised to be titled towards under watering when in doubt - but in this heat, should we do that? Probably, by putting the shades, I am bring the heat down and thereby the soil moisture is not evaporating as it would otherwise do. 3/ While I do put the plants under 50% shade (and sometimes double 50% shade - I did these a week back when the temperatures used to go upto 105). I am just thinking whether light through the 50% shade, is it enough for both the tomatoes and pepper sun loving plants to fruit later? When they say 6-8 hours of direct sunlight for tomatoes and pepper, does that mean direct unobstructed sunlight???? 4/ As for fertilization, I dont have quite a lot of option - either those NPK pellets or composted cow manure. The nursery guy tells me to sprinkle composted cow manure (his preference) over the soil once every month - but I am not quite sure about his ability / experience with container vegetables. What would you advise? How about composted cow manure tea as part of each watering or some other periodical watering? 5/ The potting soil that I use does drain but then how to measure its drainage effectiveness. What is the yardstick to measure it. When I water it for 30 seconds continuously, it starts to drain from the bottom holes but not like running water - just drop by drop - each of the 6-8 holes start dripping. Now this drop by drop could go on for an hour or two. The dripping speed may be high to start with but slows down as time passes. Does this mean the soil is good enough? Isn't that excess water sitting there for 2 hours inside the container harmful for the roots. Did that cause the signs of over watering / yellowing of leaves to appear on the tomato leaves? 6/ Unfortunately, at the moment, in my apartment there is no provision for florescent lights. I was however, thinking of putting four 20W CFL bulbs - two warm and two cool. How far should they be from the top of the seedlings? Is 80W going to be enough? How long the seedling should be sitting in light? And can the CFL be installed top down (standing upside down) rather than left right (laying)? Sorry for asking you so many question in just one post. I hope you don't mind that. Your much appreciate help awaited. Thanks and best regards Saood This post was edited by saood on Tue, Oct 1, 13 at 6:37
...See More
Fruit trees and Veggie in High Desert
Q
Comments (16)
This spring I'm trying a selection of the early tomatoes that are promoted as cool-tolerant with the ability to set fruit at lower temperatures. (I haven't found anybody making those claims for peppers, though. LOL) The varieties I have growing outside now are listed below, along with and my notes on why I selected them. The ones that do well, I will grow again, most likely in my fall garden. I have been growing the Bloody Butcher the longest, and it set its first fruit in early December and a #@!$%# ground squirrel just made off with the biggest tomato today. grrrr Jan Glacier Originally from Sweden. Very early (45-55 dtm), very cold tolerant, high yielding tomato. This special strain begins flowering when only 4 inches high. Expect high yields of 2-3 oz fruit, excellent for salads and slicing. The sweet, rich taste is similar to that found in larger, later season tomatoes. Potato-leaf foliage. Siberian Fruits grow to 3-5oz and are borne in clusters. The juicy fruits have a delicious flavor roundly considered one of the best of the early types. Unlike most tomatoes this variety sets fruits in cool weather, even at just a few degrees above freezing! Determinate. 55-58 days. Silvery Fir Tree Known for its carrot-like foliage with a slight silver tinge. Plants are short and bear heavy crops of medium sized flattish tomatoes with a good flavor. Along with its attractive foliage, this variety is also popular for short or late season tomato growers as it produces in just 58 days. Determinate. Stupice A native of Czechoslovakia, where its extreme earliness, tolerance to cold, superior flavor and high yields have earned it worldwide attention. Tests show an astounding average of 87 fruits picked per plant. Fruits are sugary sweet, weighing 1 to 2 oz. Cold hardy tomato bearing 3-6 oz. fruits in large clusters. Plants are potato-leaved and can grow to a few feet. This variety bears particularly well in short-seasons or cooler areas. Fruits are good-sized and have a great flavor. Originally from Czechoslovakia. 55 days. SubArctic Plenty Allegedly developed in the 1940's by the U.S. Military to provide fresh tomatoes to their troops in Greenland. If your weather turns cold after you set out plants, try this variety. Sets hundreds of small, 1 to 2", red fruits with that tart, "real tomato" flavor. Hardier than virtually any other variety we offer. Extremely early maturity. No need to stake. Bloody Butcher A small 3-4 oz clusterÂ tomato. Fruit are deep red in color and have a nice tomato flavor. Production is really good, but where this open-pollinated tomato really shines is its earliness. It ripens in only about 60 days, making it ripen about the same time as Early Girl, but this tomato is much tastier. Northern Exposure Hybrid 8 oz. fruits are borne on ompact, semi-determinate plants which are bred specifically for cool, short season areas. Ready to pick 67 days from setting plants outside. Determinate Sophie's Choicean extra early tomato - highly productive, flavorful and large-fruited. Unlike other extra-early varieties, the fruits are flavorful and large, averaging 6 to 8 ounces and weighing up to 12 ounces. Produces large fruit on a small plant only 18 to 24" tall. Quality is best in cool climates.
...See More
seysonn
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I think in hot and dry summer( no rain, low RH, like So. CA, in July) You have to water your plants more often and I don't think there is a shortcut for it. What you can do is try to pick a medium with more moisture retention and a location that limits direct sun to about 6 hours daily. Obviously bigger container is advantageous in storing more moisture , longer. I would also choose WHITE or light color plastic container ( as opposed to black) to reflect and radiate some of the heat away. I have the oposit situation here. So I choose black containers and I can get by with smaller containers.

Also try to mulch the top of your container with bark nuggets to minimize evaporation and getting the soil hot. In a plastic container, water/moisture is evaporated from the top surface and the foliage only.
Charlie
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I read about a method of gardening suite to hot, dry areas called keyhole gardening. Here is a website.

http://www.texascooppower.com/texas-stories/nature-outdoors/keyhole-gardening
csross
Original Author
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Thanks very much. I used shade cloth to keep tomato plants alive through last summer in my raised bed, and one of the reasons I want to try containers is so I can move them to follow or avoid the sun as necessary. I also just discovered self-watering containers, so I'm looking into them now. Lots to think about!
zeuspaul
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I am a little south of you in north county San Diego. Last year was my first year with container vegetables. I have full sun and lots of drying wind all day long.

I had excellent results with summer squash. No matter what I do in the garden, squash wilts mid day. In the container garden there was no wilting and high production. Very good success with basil and broccoli. Bell peppers were good but some of the garden peppers did better. Same for tomatoes.

Bigger pots do better as they hold more water. i water about once a day.

The squash was in 20 gal pots which seems adequate. Some squash in #15 (12 gal) did ok. #15 for tomatoes seemed too small. 25 gal for tomatoes was ok but I want bigger. For smaller plants it is ok but I am trying 40 gal for bigger plants this year.

Basil did fine in 5 gal pots. However You can't leave for a day or two unwatered so bigger is better.

This year I am going to get saucers for watering if I have to leave them for a couple of days. Saucers for the 20 gal and up is more difficult I may try to make my own with concrete.

I like the Earth Gro ground cover bark at Home Depot. Batches vary a lot. Sometimes it is good, sometimes not so good.

My biggest mistake last year was not enough nitrogen. The bark eats it up.

I mix about eight parts bark, one peat, one Kellogs Amend (composted poultry manure, rice hulls, gypsum and etc.) and one part calcined clay (kitty litter) I add Vigoro citrus and avocado fert (has some micros and slow release nitrogen), gypsum,epsom salt and dolomite lime and a little Am nitrate to the upper half of the containers.

I use black nursery pots because they are the cheapest pots I can find. Twelve bucks for 25 gal and 22 bucks for a forty.

Zeuspaul
albert_135 　 39.17°N 119.76°W 4695ft.
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
The best memories of gardening in Phoenix are of Armenian cucumbers. They seemed to thrive on the heat and sun. I should think they would thrive in containers.
kathy9norcal
10 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I have alot of container plants and always use redwood bark mulch to keep them alive. I live near Sacramento and it is HOT in summers. With the bark, I can water just once a day.

Tips for growing veggies in containers in a desert

Comments (8)

desert_cat_ca

oxboy555

Related Discussions

seysonn

Charlie

csross
Original Author

zeuspaul

albert_135 　 39.17°N 119.76°W 4695ft.

kathy9norcal

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

Tips for growing veggies in containers in a desert

Comments (8)

desert_cat_ca

oxboy555

Related Discussions

seysonn

Charlie

csrossOriginal Author

zeuspaul

albert_135 39.17°N 119.76°W 4695ft.

kathy9norcal

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

csross
Original Author

albert_135 　 39.17°N 119.76°W 4695ft.